J-20 5th Generation Fighter VII

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Totoro

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Deino said:
Point is as mentioned by others already, that both the 176th and 172nd are training units with - at least as it seems - only one Dadui of 10 J-20s each. Only the 9th AB at Wuhu seems to have a full complement of three and as such eventually even up to 30 J-20s, The 1st at Anshan IMO has for the moment only one.

As such I think there are realistically 2 training daduis and 4 frontline fighter daduis or up to 60 J-20s in service, but surely not 120 or as the SCMP claims 150.
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Not sure if I understand you here. Are you saying that the 9th Brigade has 3 groups of 10 J-20 planes?
Or that it *may have* 30 planes in the future but right now it doesn't?
Or that it may have 30 but right now we don't know how many it has?

If it indeed does have 30 planes, would that be the first and only occasion where a unit having planes larger than J10 has more than 24 planes? It was my impression that most of the large fighter brigades in PLAAF had 3 groups of 8 planes each. J-11 units have 24 planes, no? J-16 as well? Su-30 units had even fewer planes if I'm not mistaken...
 
Deino

Deino

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Totoro said:
Not sure if I understand you here. Are you saying that the 9th Brigade has 3 groups of 10 J-20 planes?
Or that it *may have* 30 planes in the future but right now it doesn't?
Or that it may have 30 but right now we don't know how many it has?

...
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Sorry, seems as my post written yesterday even caused some confusion as @Bltizo already noted too.

Ok, so far we have confirmation for the following J-20s excluding prototypes/pre-serials:

1636365985478.png

we all know - or at least it is commonly accepted - this list is not complete and is therefore at best a minimum list, but IMO it allows an attempt to estimate:


176th AB: confirmed are 8 J-20s ... but I won't be surprised it is one fully equipped dadui of 10




172nd AB: confirmed are only J-20s ... but the interesting part is, they show different serial numbers denoting maybe different daduis. As such I won't be surprised if the 7803x numbers on J-20As are the first dadui (eventually up to no. 78130) and the 7823x numbers on J-20s are from the second dadui. So maybe it has two daduis equipped with 10 each

9th AB: confirmed are 13 J-20s but again the serials are maybe a hint for more. Here I think we can be save that at least two daduis equipped with 10 each can be expected (62001-62100 & 62101-62200) but we also know no. 27 or 62207. So either this is a faked one or there is indeed the 27th J-20 within the 9th AB, which makes it likely that then there is also a third dadui equipped.

1st AB: confirmed so far is only 1 J-20A (no. 61022 or no. 02) but I think we can expect that at least one dadui - if not by year's end already two daduis - is/are equipped with 10 J-20As.

Sorry again for the confusion.
 
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Deino

Deino

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Totoro said:
...

If it indeed does have 30 planes, would that be the first and only occasion where a unit having planes larger than J10 has more than 24 planes? It was my impression that most of the large fighter brigades in PLAAF had 3 groups of 8 planes each. J-11 units have 24 planes, no? J-16 as well? Su-30 units had even fewer planes if I'm not mistaken...
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Indeed. So far all regiments and soon thereafter all brigades had commonly only 24 single seater + 4 twin seater but in recent years several brigades have gained additional ones. A prime example is the 1st AB at Anshan, which - even if flying the oldest Batch 01 J-11Bs - gained additional Batch 07 J-11Bs up to no. 30

1636366769595.png

... in the same way it received additional 4 BS twin seater ranging from no, 31-38:

1636366820692.png

So in conclusion I see or at least expect - that several brigades will be expanded to 30 single seater + 8 twin seater.

But again, just my 2 cents.
 
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Totoro

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I see, thanks. Is that a fairly recent development?
And just to confirm - are you saying that ALL J-11 units, no matter if they're A or B models, have at least single seater and and least 4 twin seaters?
So basically if they're going from 24 single seaters to 30 single seaters - their air groups are being expanded from 8 to 10 planes?
But if their air group is 10 planes, how many planes are there in their basic flying squadron? I guess there can be only 5. So 5 planes per flying squadron as the most basic unit. Two flying squadrons per air group. And 3 air groups per brigade?
In such organization the twin seaters would, I presume, remain as a separate air group? Two flying squadrons of 4 twin seaters each, per that one air group?

Also, are twin seaters like JH-7 and J-16 still at 24 planes per brigade? 3 air groups of 8 planes each? With 4 planes per flying squadron and two flying squadrons per air group?
 
Deino

Deino

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Totoro said:
I see, thanks. Is that a fairly recent development?
And just to confirm - are you saying that ALL J-11 units, no matter if they're A or B models, have at least single seater and and least 4 twin seaters?
So basically if they're going from 24 single seaters to 30 single seaters - their air groups are being expanded from 8 to 10 planes?
But if their air group is 10 planes, how many planes are there in their basic flying squadron? I guess there can be only 5. So 5 planes per flying squadron as the most basic unit. Two flying squadrons per air group. And 3 air groups per brigade?
In such organization the twin seaters would, I presume, remain as a separate air group? Two flying squadrons of 4 twin seaters each, per that one air group?

Also, are twin seaters like JH-7 and J-16 still at 24 planes per brigade? 3 air groups of 8 planes each? With 4 planes per flying squadron and two flying squadrons per air group?
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In fact I didn't have the time to check all Flanker units - in fact still on my "to do list" for an ongoing project - as such I only checked the 1st one, but several other units also had an expansion in numbers. If always to 30 + 8 and in what organisation, I haven't checked.

Sorry.
 
siegecrossbow

siegecrossbow

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Interview for Air Force Day.

VfkXuY2.jpg


aKkQaaN.jpg


Just so you know the guy is a journalist and not a new J-20 pilot.
 
L

latenlazy

Brigadier
Deino said:
Sorry, seems as my post written yesterday even caused some confusion as @Bltizo already noted too.

Ok, so far we have confirmation for the following J-20s excluding prototypes/pre-serials:

View attachment 78868

we all know - or at least it is commonly accepted - this list is not complete and is therefore at best a minimum list, but IMO it allows an attempt to estimate:


176th AB: confirmed are 8 J-20s ... but I won't be surprised it is one fully equipped dadui of 10




172nd AB: confirmed are only J-20s ... but the interesting part is, they show different serial numbers denoting maybe different daduis. As such I won't be surprised if the 7803x numbers on J-20As are the first dadui (eventually up to no. 78130) and the 7823x numbers on J-20s are from the second dadui. So maybe it has two daduis equipped with 10 each

9th AB: confirmed are 13 J-20s but again the serials are maybe a hint for more. Here I think we can be save that at least two daduis equipped with 10 each can be expected (62001-62100 & 62101-62200) but we also know no. 27 or 62207. So either this is a faked one or there is indeed the 27th J-20 within the 9th AB, which makes it likely that then there is also a third dadui equipped.

1st AB: confirmed so far is only 1 J-20A (no. 61022 or no. 02) but I think we can expect that at least one dadui - if not by year's end already two daduis - is/are equipped with 10 J-20As.

Sorry again for the confusion.
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Do these counts include the WS-10 equipped J-20s?
 
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