J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread V

[Blitzo]

Seriously, Blitzo? I took you to be the 'marketplace of free ideas, and let the best one win' kind of person.

I'm generally weary of media from The National Interest, because it's the neocon waterhole, with its own narrow-view agendas. Nevertheless, it's good to read such sources, even if for no reason other than 'keeping the Bible in one hand, and the New York Times in the other, so you know what both camps are thinking about.'

I'm all for reading ideas of all kinds.

But let's acknowledge rubbish ideas when we see it and don't give credit to those who do not deserve it.


And the National Interest's defence section run by Dave Majumdar is firmly in that category, and this article is just another example of it.


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edit: let's put it this way -- feel free to post things from Dave Majumdar (David Axe, Kyle Mizokami etc), but please don't post their content while also giving them any accolades or respect that their writings do not deserve.

 

[latenlazy]

Seriously, Blitzo? I took you to be the 'marketplace of free ideas, and let the best one win' kind of person.

I'm generally weary of media from The National Interest, because it's the neocon waterhole, with its own narrow-view agendas. Nevertheless, it's good to read such sources, even if for no reason other than "keep the Bible in one hand, and the New York Times in the other, so you know what both camps are thinking."

Sometimes that Bible is not a Bible but Dianetics by L. Ron Hubbard.

 

[Blackstone]

I'm all for reading ideas of all kinds.

But let's acknowledge rubbish ideas when we see it and don't give credit to those who do not deserve it.


And the National Interest's defence section run by Dave Majumdar is firmly in that category, and this article is just another example of it.

There are good reasons to be weary of The National Interest, and all other agenda media, because they might not be accurate, balanced or complete. Nevertheless, we should consider their offerings on an individual basis, because at the end of the day, these folks are intelligent, educated, and we may learn a thing or two from them. That's why I try to read articles and watch videos from all major camps.

 

[Blackstone]

Sometimes that Bible is not a Bible but Dianetics by L. Ron Hubbard.

No problem, just put something opposite of Dianetics/Scientology in your other hand, so you know what both sides are thinking.

 

[Blitzo]

There are good reasons to be weary of The National Interest, and all other agenda media, because they might not be accurate, balanced or complete. Nevertheless, we should consider their offerings on an individual basis, because at the end of the day, these folks are intelligent, educated, and we may learn a thing or two from them. That's why I try to read and watch presentation videos from all major camps.

I believe the National Interest overall can have occasionally feature good content from guest contributors.

However, their defence column run by Dave Majumdar is simply terrible, and even reading their articles on a case by case basis the average quality is humiliatingly low. This particular article unfortunately is even worse than their average write up.


Obviously, when I say we should assess the stupidity of articles, it is on an individual basis. And on an individual basis, this article is simply ridiculous. You've been on SDF for quite a few years with immersion of many good China defence watchers, so the fact that you are not completely laughing at the content of article is bizarre.

 

[latenlazy]

No problem, just put something opposite of Dianetics/Scientology in your other hand, so you know what both sides are thinking.

Sometimes there isn't an opposite equivalent (In this case with Majumdar though there is, but we openly scoff at his opposite, so why regard Majumdar with any seriousness?).

 

[shen]

edit: let's put it this way -- feel free to post things from Dave Majumdar (David Axe, Kyle Mizokami etc), but please don't post their content while also giving them any accolades or respect that their writings do not deserve.

but please post the author's name, so we know not to click on the link

 

[AssassinsMace]

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Nice!

 

[Hyperwarp]

Interesting take on the J-20.

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Why do they need the Su-35?

J-20 is the most complicated fighter PRC has ever build and production is going to be slower than any other. They won't be building them like J-7 or even J-10. But that is not even the issue. Issue is J-20 is still not a mature platform. It is just in LRIP. It will go in to some PLAAF test squadron first. It will take some time to even reach IOC. F-22 reached IOC in 2005 after the 1st prototype flew in 1997 (no, not the YF-22).

Look carefully and you will see a gap developing in the PLAAF when it comes to heavy fighters. J-10B/C are good leap forwards from the J-10A especially EW systems but the J-10 is a medium fighter. When it comes to heavy long ranged fighters PLAAF has Su-27UBK, Su-30MKK, J-11/11A that are R-77 compatible and PL-12 compatible J-11B series. But tech wise they don't compare to the J-10B/C. Rumors are some J-20 tech is used in the J-10C. This gap should have been filled by the J-11D. But where is it?

Su-35 is a mature platform and it is the best flanker money can buy. It will give the PLAAF a substantial leap when it comes to heavy long-ranged fighters including super-maneuverability and super-cruise. It lacks stealth, but that will be eventually filled by the J-20.

 

[Blitzo]

Why do they need the Su-35?

J-20 is the most complicated fighter PRC has ever build and production is going to be slower than any other. They won't be building them like J-7 or even J-10. But that is not even the issue. Issue is J-20 is still not a mature platform. It is just in LRIP. It will go in to some PLAAF test squadron first. It will take some time to even reach IOC. F-22 reached IOC in 2005 after the 1st prototype flew in 1997 (no, not the YF-22).

Look carefully and you will see a gap developing in the PLAAF when it comes to heavy fighters. J-10B/C are good leap forwards from the J-10A especially EW systems but the J-10 is a medium fighter. When it comes to heavy long ranged fighters PLAAF has Su-27UBK, Su-30MKK, J-11/11A that are R-77 compatible and PL-12 compatible J-11B series. But tech wise they don't compare to the J-10B/C. Rumors are some J-20 tech is used in the J-10C. This gap should have been filled by the J-11D. But where is it?

Su-35 is a mature platform and it is the best flanker money can buy. It will give the PLAAF a substantial leap when it comes to heavy long-ranged fighters including super-maneuverability and super-cruise. It lacks stealth, but that will be eventually filled by the J-20.

Don't give oxygen to the silly article.

Not in this thread; it doesn't deserve to be relevant in this thread.



If anyone wants to talk about the Su-35 I'm pretty sure there is a dedicated thread for it somewhere; and the first thing people should be asking is why only 24? From that context, the reasons become far more well defined.