J-15 carrier fighter thread

[Gloire_bb]

Lack of urgency to switch engines or reticence to switch due to supply chain uncertainty are both actually very consistent with the need to get airframes out quicker to fill imminent needs. Switching engines requires some extra development time and production line alterations. If they started development with the AL-31s and they just want to get airframes out the door ASAP sticking with AL-31s is the much faster option.

Sort of true for any other jet, but on flanker engine nacelle is its own thing. It usually isn't viable to replace them on already built jets(though we do have examples when it's done), but otherwise it should be a matter of switch decision.

Also, another visible problem here is that target fleet for PLANAF carrier wings isn't endless. Entire CAWs are now on AL-31F, and this will apparently remain so for foreseeable future via new jets. I.e. there's a serious chance we'll enjoy seeing those into 2040s.

 

[latenlazy]

Sort of true for any other jet, but on flanker engine nacelle is its own thing. It usually isn't viable to replace them on already built jets(though we do have examples when it's done), but otherwise it should be a matter of switch decision.

An engine switch isn’t just a structural question with the nacelles. It also involves other subsystem integration details.

Also, another visible problem here is that target fleet for PLANAF carrier wings isn't endless. Entire CAWs are now on AL-31F, and this will apparently remain so for foreseeable future via new jets. I.e. there's a serious chance we'll enjoy seeing those into 2040s.

The target fleet for the PLANAF carrier wing has a pretty sizable growth runway given carrier fleet expansion prospects. Having a few more J-15s on the AL-31 is not some massive long term inconvenience when it’s sharing an engine logistics tail with the first few batches of non catapult version J-15s and when you’re probably set for retirement of earlier airframes by the time you’re reaching maximum matured naval air fleet size in two decades. It’s also entirely possible that they plan for MLUs for J-15s once there’s sufficient fighters in the carrier air wing to rotate out older J-15s during service half-life maintenance. The prospect of maintaining some long term support for AL-31s is really not as dire a matter as I think you’re making it out to be.

 

[sunnymaxi]

An engine switch isn’t just a structural question with the nacelles. It also involves other subsystem integration details.


The target fleet for the PLANAF carrier wing has a pretty sizable growth runway given carrier fleet expansion prospects. Having a few more J-15s on the AL-31 is not some massive long term inconvenience when it’s sharing an engine logistics tail with the first few batches of non catapult version J-15s and when you’re probably set for retirement of earlier airframes by the time you’re reaching maximum naval air fleet size.

as per the trio, this is purely PLAN decision to go with AL-31 as they are dealing with this engine for past 15 years build entire infrastructure and ecosystem around it. also much familiar with AL-31.

WS-10H is ready engine since 2023 and they demonstrated in last zhuhai air show as well.

 

[Gloire_bb]

The target fleet for the PLANAF carrier wing has a pretty sizable growth runway given carrier fleet expansion prospects. Having a few more J-15s on the AL-31 is not some massive long term inconvenience when it’s sharing an engine logistics tail with the first few batches of non catapult version J-15s and when you’re probably set for retirement of earlier airframes by the time you’re reaching maximum naval air fleet size.

But they'll be here long after vanillas will retire. This is a long commitment.
Tbh it isn't inconceivable these can be some of the last operational Al-31 flankers in the world.

Another notion, since we highlighted attention to this point, is that new generation of advanced Chinese escort EW pods work on Al-31 fighters. Which is interesting in itself, as these pods, together with main AESA, work off internal power.
Which possible translates onto J-16D, too...

 

[latenlazy]

But they'll be here long after vanillas will retire. This is a long commitment.

Keep in mind if the rationale is that sticking with AL-31s allows for quicker operational introduction because there’s pressing need for them now, once the carrier air wing grows in a few years that condition will no longer apply and they can relax employment in active service to do MLUs with WS-10s later, if they *really* don’t want to keep supporting AL-31s in say a decade.

 

[AndrewS]

But they'll be here long after vanillas will retire. This is a long commitment.
Tbh it isn't inconceivable these can be some of the last operational Al-31 flankers in the world.

Another notion, since we highlighted attention to this point, is that new generation of advanced Chinese escort EW pods work on Al-31 fighters. Which is interesting in itself, as these pods, together with main AESA, work off internal power.
Which possible translates onto J-16D, too...

Not necessarily.

At some point, AL-31 naval aircraft can be retired en-masse and transferred to the Air Force, where they can still be useful.

 

[Deino]

Not necessarily.

At some point, AL-31 naval aircraft can be retired en-masse and transferred to the Air Force, where they can still be useful.

Come on! Why should the PLA transfer old "retired (j-15) en-masse" to the PLAAF ?

The PLA NA will fly them until their end when they are replaced by J-35. IMO it makes no sense ...

 

[AndrewS]

Come on! Why should the PLA transfer old "retired (j-15) en-masse" to the PLAAF ?

The PLA NA will fly them until their end when they are replaced by J-35. IMO it makes no sense ...

We see J-35 production ramping up now.

But for the next 10 years, the Chinese Navy will be severely constrained by the number of aircraft carriers and how many aircraft it can debloy.

So it would make sense to maximise the number of J-35 on the carriers, but to do this, they have to remove J-15s.

 

[Wrought]

We see J-35 production ramping up now.

But for the next 10 years, the Chinese Navy will be severely constrained by the number of aircraft carriers and how many aircraft it can debloy.

So it would make sense to maximise the number of J-35 on the carriers, but to do this, they have to remove J-15s.

Nonsense, nobody runs 100% stealth platforms because it's simply suboptimal. You always want a mix of stealth and non-stealth. USN for example has had ample opportunity to phase out F/A-18 squadrons, but declined to do so. PLAN wouldn't have bothered with J-15T at all if that was the case.

As for Shenyang, they can obviously use their production capacity for J-35A.

 

[AndrewS]

Nonsense, nobody runs 100% stealth platforms because it's simply suboptimal. You always want a mix of stealth and non-stealth. USN for example has had ample opportunity to phase out F/A-18s, but declined to do so.

As for Shenyang, they can obviously use the capacity for J-35As.

For the next 10+ years, the USN (even with mixed airwings) will easily be able to deploy far more stealth fighters than the Chinese Navy.

So in order to compete for blue-water air superiority , the Chinese Navy (with fewer carriers) will need all the stealth aircraft it can field.

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Also, think about what you are proposing.

Additional J-35 for the Chinese Air Force won't actually make much difference on land, considering how many stealth fighters there will be. Call it about 1000 stealth fighters by 2030, most of which are J-20.

But additional J-35 on aircraft carriers has a much larger impact on a blue-water air battle.