I meant competent intellectuals like Li Ao and not the current batch of 御用文人 (government hired scholars).
Is Jiang Zemin Dead?
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I meant competent intellectuals like Li Ao and not the current batch of 御用文人 (government hired scholars).
solarz
Brigadier
The very reason that Li Ao is well received lies in his status as an independent Taiwanese politician. If people began to see him as associated with the CCP, then he would have no propaganda value at all.
I said that intellectuals can't do propaganda, because intellectuals invariably appeals to people's logic. Truly effective propaganda appeals to people's emotions instead.
You don't drink Coca-Cola because it's nutritious or healthy. You drink it because, somehow, you have emotionally associated the drink with being "refreshing and thirst quenching".
I beg to differ.
People already know that he is a CCP admirer. The fact is even though he has radical political beliefs the stuff he writes and the speeches he give are far superior to those made by the Pan-Green supporters. Who would listen to him if he didn't have real skills?
There are two types of writers. The majority must cater to the taste of their audiences while the few with true talent could voice their opinions, no matter how strange and different it is from the status quo.
solarz
Brigadier
Sure he's a CCP admirer, but he's not a part of the CCP, and that's the crucial difference. We're not talking about the kind of support the CCP can drum up, but rather, the kind of propaganda the CCP themselves can produce.
As such, we can throw any semblance of objectivity out the window, and with it, any kind of intellectual argument. That kind of exercise is for Xinhua (which, as you might surmise, is not very effective at it).
Instead of making a movie about the founding of the CCP, why not make a movie about how China managed to put an astronaut into space? Or make a movie about the building of the Three-Gorges Dam -- don't ignore the negative impact or the hardships suffered by the displaced inhabitants, but frame it in a positive light and showcase the efforts of the government to minimize said impact and hardships.
Ultimately, the real problem with the CCP's propaganda is that it's not aimed at the people... it's aimed at the leaders on top. Bo Xilai didn't organize a "Red Extravaganza" to entertain the people: he did it to please his superiors.
did you read what he wrote about the two movies that suppose to celenrate the founding of PRC and CCP, the Pièce de résistance of propaganda dept in this crucial year, is, and I quote:
" is another "LET'S F*CK THE AUTHORITIES AT THEIR BIG DAY" production"
He think those two movies are not politically correct enough.
sounds very much like some one who frequent "Utopia"/Wu You Zhi Xiang
( for reference)
And I whole heartly agree the propaganda dept summarily should be fired. bit of an embarrassment really.
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solarz
Brigadier
This tells me that more and more overseas Chinese are willing to contribute their talents to their "Nation of Ancestry".
Why is that a bad thing?
(And if you tell me they get paid, a lot, let me remind you that *everyone* should get properly compensated for their work, and it does not diminish the value of their work by one iota.)
But here you're doing a bit of "propaganda" yourself, aren't you? Somewhere in his post there is a reference to a contraposition of pre-"reform-and-opening-up" and the period that follows.did you read what he wrote about the two movies that suppose to celenrate the founding of PRC and CCP, the Pièce de résistance of propaganda dept in this crucial year, is, and I quote:
" is another "LET'S F*CK THE AUTHORITIES AT THEIR BIG DAY" production"
He think those two movies are not politically correct enough.
sounds very much like some one who frequent "Utopia"/Wu You Zhi Xiang
( for reference)
And I whole heartly agree the propaganda dept summarily should be fired. bit of an embarrassment really.
I have not watched the movie, and probably won't, but I have seen this phenomenon quite a bit when contemporary Chinese history is discussed. There is a tendency in some circles to trash everything that came before 1978. Red__Sword is saying these movies are examples of that. Now, if you agree with this view yourself, you should say so DIRECTLY, rather than pinning labels on people that disagree with you.
You can have whatever opinion you like. My point is simple: the line of argument you are pursuing is simply TRASHY. I don't think it belongs here.
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what exactly is the line of argument I am pursuing here? and how is that trashy?
all i did was a make an observation on his ideological outlook based on what he said.
and I think I am pretty clear that I don't agree with his view that these movies are examples of trashing pre-79. or else I wouldn't make fun of that view would I?
Red___Sword
Junior Member
Looks like our resident lefty is not amused.
take a pill, drink some water, and chill man.
No harm in these movies. They got official backing of "Propaganda Dept" of the communists. or you think it is all capitalist roaders in the CPC now and it is time for a good ole fashioned Anti-Rightist movement?
Did I get all the lingos correct?
Anyways, as we can see the current communist is disliked by both the "true" leftist and the right leaning "capitalists". I always consider being disliked by extremists a sign of you are doing some correct.
Hahahaha..... with all due respect (this is not 客套, I do respect you) i.e. - of all the people, you, calling me "resident lefty"? (ask around, the "resident righty"'s opinion on, YOU) ... I am flattered.
Yes, my propaganda skills need improvement so that next time I would use "independent producer with shitty
understanding of both ROC and PRC revolution who only trying to make fast money by B.S. the past history to entertain the masses" to substitute "mafia background commercial production"...
Take a pill and rest assured, I am not Red Guard (take a look at my ID), I do not waving flags for the bureaucracy. I just "read" movies.
Thanks pal, sorry to make it looks like "the reds are planning a move". (take a look at your ID).
My point:
post-1978, there were people, not necessary with a "morality correctness", making fast money. They succeed, raise to a whole new class (damn, I used "class" again), on the sacrifice of FAIR, JUSTICE, HUMAN RIGHTS of the lowly masses (the very things free market needs). They are not political, not doing CCP's bit, not neccessary trying to "take the throne" - they are indeed a whole new prestigous class.
By doing that, ruins the social stability, people more and more pissed about the current unfair social reallity (fairness, among all the other sweet talks of human rights, is the most important aspect of Chinese life), people trying to figure out whos the "bad guy" took their fairness.
Being at the convinient position of "commercial business", the prestigous class made massive vox populi manipulation 舆论引导, pointing the finger, "see, who sits on the throne? blame them!" - why you would trust this? because they are "independent commercial production", they said so.
CPC dose made mistakes throughout the time, the point is the bad guys dodge the bullets, everytime.
The TWO PRESENT MOVIEs, are such independent production. Like I said, they make it so good you can't feel it by watch it, you need to "read" it.
Saying that, a minor OT - solarz, being a good (and genuine) "overseas ethnic Chinese", you have no idea what the joke of "foreigners" in China is about, if you do not "read" the China society but simply substitute your own experience.
PS. A clarification, I have no doubt about you or any other oversea ethnic Chinese on this forum under whatever moral standard to being a good people among the society you lives - it's just the "foreign Chinese" in China, not the buch you thought would be.
You do NOT address the views in his post, at all. Instead, there's some sort of red-baiting. That's trashy. We all have an "ideological outlook". Many people here also have a "religion", and there are also national feelings. ALL OF THESE ARE ALLOWED.
What you did in your posts is ascribe to him views which he has not expressed himself: For example, in #47 you wrote,
As an aside, from a quick look at that link, plus the statement of yours which I quoted, it seems that except for your use of the word "left", you have not understood anything he wrote.
What you did in your posts is ascribe to him views which he has not expressed himself: For example, in #47 you wrote,
and in #55 you post a link to some particular left publication, without any evidence at all that he supports those particular views. You are putting words in his mouth.
As an aside, from a quick look at that link, plus the statement of yours which I quoted, it seems that except for your use of the word "left", you have not understood anything he wrote.
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