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Lethe

Captain
Building a modified Vikrant is a more sensible route for India to achieve its carrier availability goals than embarking upon the previously mooted generation-scale project to produce a 65k-tonne, nuclear-powered, EMALS-equipped carrier would've been. It's a decision that should've been made several years ago, but at least it has now been made.

A possible future stumbling block is that TEDBF may well not meet schedule or other project goals and at some point IN may be tempted to go back to Dassault for another small-scale Rafale order, at significantly greater cost than if they had negotiated either a larger number of airframes in the first place, or at least included option clauses for additional airframes in the contract.
 
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gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Honestly, India misappropriation of fund will led them to a decade of lost economic development, this kind of spending are ego boosting effort rather than Nation building. I mean who want to invade India? Just like the US, they were protected from both side by Indian Ocean and from the North the mighty Himalaya Mountain. To gain respect you need to have a vibrant economy, an economy where your neighbor will envy and want to trade with you rather than fight you.
Agreed. This reminds me of the naval arms race between Brazil and Argentina. A pointless waste of money.
 

Pataliputra

Junior Member
Registered Member
I've gathered that the payload capacity of Tejas MK1A exceeds the Tejas MK1 by 1000-1200 kg, accomplished by eliminating dead weight and utilizing superior composite materials. This enhancement implies a potential increase in Tejas' range and maneuverability in the upcoming production iterations. The missing element remains the indigenous Kaveri turbofan Engine. Once integrated, Tejas will become immune to Western sanctions. While pre-emptive acquisition of engines and spare parts can safeguard against American sanctions, reliance on an Indian engine will render it impervious.
 

Gloire_bb

Captain
Registered Member
Once integrated, Tejas will become immune to Western sanctions.
?
As far as i understand, at least the initial mk1a have Israeli/american parts in literally all the key components(propulsive - engine, SA/Offensive - radar, defensive - EW suit), +Martin-Baker ejection seat(UK).
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
Wasn't Kaveri program as an Indian indigenous program cancelled after too many challenges and changed to simply using M88 from Safran/SNECMA?

M88 is a suitable sized and powered engine for the Tejas but certainly not quite in the thrust class of engines like RD-33, F-404/414, WS-13, WS-19/21 (forget which is the next gen engine for J-35).

Switching Tejas engine from F-414 to M88 would seriously degrade its performance and require a fair bit of redesign and manufacturing retooling. Unless Safran is willing to completely develop another engine for Kaveri, Tejas will be sticking with F-404/414 and India can simply play politics with the US for securing supplies.
 

Lethe

Captain
Folks who are interested in Indian military procurement matters but struggle with the nomenclature of AoN, SQRs, DAC, CCS, etc. may find
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epic tome useful.

Wasn't Kaveri program as an Indian indigenous program cancelled after too many challenges and changed to simply using M88 from Safran/SNECMA?

M88 is a suitable sized and powered engine for the Tejas but certainly not quite in the thrust class of engines like RD-33, F-404/414, WS-13, WS-19/21 (forget which is the next gen engine for J-35).

Switching Tejas engine from F-414 to M88 would seriously degrade its performance and require a fair bit of redesign and manufacturing retooling. Unless Safran is willing to completely develop another engine for Kaveri, Tejas will be sticking with F-404/414 and India can simply play politics with the US for securing supplies.

The mooted GTRE-Safran engine is planned to be derived from M88 technology but developing significantly more thrust (+50%) than the current M88-2 used on Rafale. It is likely that some of this uplift will come via increased size (M88 is smaller and lighter than F414). That may be the plan, however the history of both Indian turbofan development and JVs with real technology transfer is a ruinous one, so I would not get too excited at this point.
 
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_killuminati_

Senior Member
Registered Member
If India doesn't want to get fully into bed with the US and is growing cold on Russia, then there's always France. As a Rafale user, India should jump aboard the mooted 'Super Rafale' program and, if possible, co-develop Rafale's successor. For their part, the French probably greatly resent being stuck with Germany as a (unreliable) partner for major military projects and would likely welcome India with open arms. Of course France also supplies India's best submarines - Scorpene.
What benefit is it to France to have India as a co-developer? Germany is a major industrial, technical and scientific hub of invention and innovation. India is still in that 'several decades behind, catching up' phase. I mean, what could India contribute to any project that the French don't already know? Decades of Indian partnership with Russia could not co-produce anything major, what will change now?
 
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