india finally gives information that it has leased a akula

sidewinder

New Member
India Today:
DEFENCE: NUCLEAR SUBMARINE
The Secret Nuke Sub Deal

By Sandeep Unnithan

On June 15, 2008, the Indian Navy will commission the INS Chakra, a 12,000-tonne Akula-II class nuclear-powered attack submarine, from the far eastern Russian port of Vladivostok. The submarine, which is being built at a shipyard in Komsomolsk-on-Amur, marks the fruition of a $650-million (Rs 2,600 crore) secret deal signed by the NDA government three-and-a-half years ago, which said that India would finance the construction of an unfinished Russian nuclear submarine hull and then lease it for 10 years. The impending acquisition of the Chakra gives India the long-awaited third leg of the nuclear triad—the others being air and land-based nuclear delivery platforms—widely regarded as the most survivable mode of launching nuclear weapons.

“It is the most crucial strategic capability we are acquiring after testing nuclear weapons in 1998,” says strategic analyst Bharat Karnad. Manned by a specially trained Indian crew, the Chakra—named after Krishna’s weapon—will undertake a 15-day passage through the South China Sea, with no port calls, to India, where it will be formally inducted as a component of India’s strategic forces command.

Nuclear submarines use a miniature nuclear reactor, to produce steam, which drives a turbine. Capable of tremendous underwater speed and almost unlimited endurance, they are in fact limited only by the endurance of their crew. The Akula-II submarine’s speed of 35 knots and diving depth of 600 m is twice that of a conventionally powered submarine. “However, a nuclear submarine is much more than just a submarine with a nuclear reactor,” says Rear Admiral (retired) Raja Menon. “It is the arbiter of power at sea,” he adds.

Armed with indigenously built nuclear-tipped cruise missiles with a range of over 1,000 km, the Chakra will be a potent addition to India’s strategic arsenal. A need which was felt after the Pokhran tests of 1998 when India enunciated a nuclear doctrine of ‘no first use’ and nuclear forces based on a triad of aircraft, mobile land-based missiles and sea-based assets, to ensure that its nuclear deterrent was “effective, enduring, diverse, flexible, and responsive to the requirements of credible minimum deterrence”. While the road and rail-mobile Agni series missiles afforded the land-based legs of the triad, the focus quickly shifted on inducting submarines armed with nuclear weapons. India’s Advanced Technology Vessel (ATV), a euphemism for a nuclear-powered ballistic missile submarine (SSBN) project initiated in the 1970s was still a decade from induction.

Hence talks on leasing two Akula class submarines—later reduced to one—were begun by the Vajpayee government after the Kargil War in 1999. Code-named Project (I), it was part of the three key naval items on the list of the Indian-Russian Inter-Governmental Commission on Military Technical Cooperation initiated by the government in 2002. The other two items on the list were the purchase of the Admiral Gorshkov aircraft carrier, and the lease of four Tu-22M strategic bombers (which has since been cancelled). Funds for the submarine lease were allotted by the Central Government, but never publicised. The deal for leasing the submarine was signed quietly in Delhi in January 2004 along with the Gorshkov deal, during Russian Defence Minister Sergei Ivanov’s visit.

Yet for years, the government denied plans of leasing nuclear submarines. Ivanov, too, consistently denied reports of the lease, but in 2005, the Russian daily Kommersant noted that the unaccounted for spike in the country’s arms export earnings indicated that the lease had been paid up.

The Chakra will soon be joined by the indigenous ATV, under construction at a secret dry dock in Visakhapatnam. Construction of the 5,000-tonne ATV, a modified version of the Russian Charlie-II class is now nearly complete, and will be launched for sea trials next year. It will be inducted into the Indian Navy in 2009. Armed with indigenously developed ballistic missiles (future variants with the three-stage 5000-km range Agni 3), the ATV will mark India’s entry into the SSBN club and will mean the fruition of a long-delayed strategic programme.

The delays seem to have moved to the Russian side. Originally slated for induction on August 15 this year, the delivery of the Chakra has been delayed by 10 months for the same reasons that delayed the Gorshkov refit in Russia. Earlier this year, Russia escalated the cost of the N sub lease by $135 million (Rs 540 crore), which was rejected by the Indian Defence Ministry delegation. Ministry officials confirmed the advanced stage of both the lease and the projects and said that the Government was debating on when to bring both the programmes out of the closet.

The lease of the Akula-II submarine—originally slated for the cash-strapped Russian Navy and on which construction had ceased at the Amur shipyard in the 1990s—will make India the world’s sixth power to operate a nuclear submarine. It has only one precedent—the three-year transfer of a Charlie-I class nuclear attack submarine (also named Chakra) from the Soviet Union in January 1988, which took advantage of a loophole in international treaties. The treaties prohibit the sale of nuclear submarines but do not object to a lease, provided the submarines are not equipped with nuclear weapons or missiles with a range of over 300 km. The Chakra will be stripped of its inventory of strategic cruise missiles with a range of 3,000 km, as these violate the Missile Technology Control Regime, but India will not be prevented from equipping the submarine with its own missiles.

The present 10-year lease—which may be extended later—differs from that of the Charlie-I class submarine in some important aspects. While the latter’s reactor controls and missile launch area were manned by Soviet naval personnel, the new Chakra will be manned entirely by an Indian crew, which is to leave for Vladivostok in December. Nearly 300 Indian naval personnel, or three sets of crews, have already been trained to man the submarine at a specially constructed facility in Sosnovy Bor, a small town near St Petersburg in Russia. All personnel returned after completion of training this year.

Future ATV crews will also be trained on the Chakra, which offers a valuable training platform. “A leased submarine gives you a tremendous headstart in training crews,” says Menon. “It takes several years to produce a crew of nuclear submarine experts like hydroplane operators and watch keeping officers.” The new Chakra will make up for the expertise that was lost when the Charlie-I submarine was returned to the former Soviet Union but also add a strategic platform into India’s inventory.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
India Today:
DEFENCE: NUCLEAR SUBMARINE
The Secret Nuke Sub Deal

By Sandeep Unnithan

On June 15, 2008, the Indian Navy will commission the INS Chakra, a 12,000-tonne Akula-II class nuclear-powered attack submarine, from the far eastern Russian port of Vladivostok. The submarine, which is being built at a shipyard in Komsomolsk-on-Amur, marks the fruition of a $650-million (Rs 2,600 crore) secret deal signed by the NDA government three-and-a-half years ago, which said that India would finance the construction of an unfinished Russian nuclear submarine hull and then lease it for 10 years. The impending acquisition of the Chakra gives India the long-awaited third leg of the nuclear triad—the others being air and land-based nuclear delivery platforms—widely regarded as the most survivable mode of launching nuclear weapons.

“It is the most crucial strategic capability we are acquiring after testing nuclear weapons in 1998,” says strategic analyst Bharat Karnad. Manned by a specially trained Indian crew, the Chakra—named after Krishna’s weapon—will undertake a 15-day passage through the South China Sea, with no port calls, to India, where it will be formally inducted as a component of India’s strategic forces command.
The Akula II is a very potent submarine. A lot of capability from environment, to weapons, to endurance. I believe the Rusians have only built two or three of the Akula II for themselves.

For India to get one is quite a coup and will represent a very powerful addition to their invenotry. But having only one means that 1/3 of the time at least, they will not have such a capability at sea...and it also just continues to add (IMHO) to the mixed bag of weaponry the Indians put to sea which has to play havoc on training and logistics.

Just the same, this is a powerful sub.

akulaII.jpg
 

sidewinder

New Member
"Manned by a specially trained Indian crew, the Chakra—named after Krishna’s weapon—will undertake a 15-day passage through the South China Sea, with no port calls, to India, where it will be formally inducted as a component of India’s strategic forces command."

dont you think that bringing the sub through the south china sea will expose the akula's acoustic signature ,screw noise signature which will be picked by china's electronic warfare systems abaord thier ssbn's instead bringing the sub through a more longer route would be preferable.
 

IDonT

Senior Member
VIP Professional
dont you think that bringing the sub through the south china sea will expose the akula's acoustic signature ,screw noise signature which will be picked by china's electronic warfare systems abaord thier ssbn's instead bringing the sub through a more longer route would be preferable.

Akula II has been around since the the early 1990's, if China did not have its acoustic signature since then, a passage in the South China Sea will not help them. This sub has been stationed in Vladivostok.

Which adds another question, does China have the ASW capability to shadow a sub this advance. The Akula II was the pinnacle of the USSR's attack subs and was built with input from espionage data related to sonar detection from the Walker spy ring in the late 1970's. It is the quietest Russian nuclear attack submarine; the noise radiated by the Akula-II class is comparable to that of early versions of the American Los Angeles class.
 

Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
Akula II has been around since the the early 1990's, if China did not have its acoustic signature since then, a passage in the South China Sea will not help them. This sub has been stationed in Vladivostok.

Which adds another question, does China have the ASW capability to shadow a sub this advance. The Akula II was the pinnacle of the USSR's attack subs and was built with input from espionage data related to sonar detection from the Walker spy ring in the late 1970's. It is the quietest Russian nuclear attack submarine; the noise radiated by the Akula-II class is comparable to that of early versions of the American Los Angeles class.

I'm sure that they could find it if they really mounted a search, but it would be difficult for them to mount a deployment of that size without raising eyebrows. Even if they only deployed subs at least the crew of the Indian boat would know.

If I were in the position to make the decision, I would steer far clear of China and go around Taiwan, and possibly around or through the Phillipines and enter the Indian Ocean around Bali, staying far clear of the various straits where the PLAN would be likely to lie in wait.
 

crobato

Colonel
VIP Professional
Exactly but then there also claims that the newer Chinese SSNs like the 093 has a noise level comparable to early or mid 688 class. So at least Chinese sensors appear to have progressed to that level. Its not a big thing either. Back in the nineties, ROCN Orions caught a 688 class trying sneak up and and take a spent ROCAF fired MICA. And they did with the 688 class in silent mode, and in the noisiest stretch of littoral water in the world, which is straits in Taiwan. [When the sub was first detected, they thought it was a Han, but the signatures was different].

688/Los Angeles class noise level at this point in time, with the advancements in sensor technology, is no longer a big thing. It should be in fact considered in the fringe of obsolescence. As cool as the Akula II is, it is no longer considered a state of the art class sub, at least compared to the Sea Wolf, Virginia, Astute and Barracuda classes. Even for the Russians and their capability.
 

tphuang

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
VIP Professional
Registered Member
i'm just puzzled where they got the idea that akula ii is capable of delivering nuclear weapons? Any honestly, if asked to pick between Club and Brahmos, I'd still pick Club.
 

crobato

Colonel
VIP Professional
If the sub will try to bypass the China seas and head out into the open Pacific Ocean, you would be a fool if the Japanese and the US would not take this golden opportunity to track and get signature readings of it. The fact that US may already have Akula II signatures is besides the point, what you would be interested to know if there are any changes to that signature.

Whatever the state of cordial relationship India has with Japan and the US becomes irrelevant under the waves, compared to the fact that its a Russian sub, and the Russians have announced their path of military resurrection and reascendancy. The information you pick off from the Chakra will be helpful in analyzing future Akula IIs or Akula II refits, or simply said the state of Russian sub and acoustic technology.

If it passes through the South China seas, Hainan island is a known area festoning with PLAN subs. If you wondered what that EP3 of that infamous incident is doing there, you would have come to a logical guess. That big island is bored with various submarine caves, filled with the PLAN's latest, including Shangs, Yuans, the latest Kilos and Songs. By mid 2008, you can expect at least a flottilla of four subs for each class of the subs mentioned. It would not be hard to imagine that the sea may have been marked with a mini SOSUS of the PLAN's own.

If you want to play smart, why not just transport the entire sub on top of a ship? With China's last 8 Kilos, 4 went through the way of Vladivostok past Japan, and 4 went through the way of the Baltic, Atlantic, and Indian Ocean. All the Japanese and Indian naval patrols can do is wave at the hands in the ship and take videos for TV. But the acoustic intel value they get from tracking the ships is zero.
 

sidewinder

New Member
dont you think the smart thing to do would be to fit a couple of machines(resonators) to generate random noise or signature during transportation and have it removed later.
 
D

Deleted member 675

Guest
Good news for the Indian Navy. This will be a very capable nuclear submarine, giving them more experience in handling ships like this until the ATVs are commissioned as well as a real kick.
 
Top