Hong-Kong Protests

solarz said:

The Russian election meddling is more exaggeration than fact. At the end of day, the American government can order Facebook or Twitter to delete content and accounts at any time.

Even if Russia was behind the Fake News activity, they were tolerated because it served the purpose of one of the American factions. In contrast, China has no sympathetic faction in the US.

China's GFW is highly effectively at blocking foreign subversion, but it is also a double edged sword as it creates a segregated content sphere from the rest of the world.

What China needs to do now is to push its content platforms toward a global audience. We are already seeing the tip of this push with the growing popularity of Tiktok.

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China doesn't need sympathetic factions in the US. In fact, the so-called faction that is sympathetic to Russia has done little good for Russia, Russia's situation after the Trump administration took office has NOT improved at all. Those Americans only use the name "Russia" as a mean to push for pro-white rhetoric. They didn't help Russia at all. East European NATO countries actually became more confrontational against Russia. Poland is ordering F-35, and Ukraine is drifting more and more towards the West. The strategic Russo-German relations are under more and more scrutiny from the US.

These social media "unconventional warfare" are not meant to cement good relations between societies/countries. They are ONLY meant to create internal division within the a society. The Russian understood this. They were NEVER expecting a more pro-Russia US administration, that wasn't what they strove for. They strove for a more divided US. As long as the US is more divided, the Russians don't care that the incoming administration ending up being more hostile towards Russia.

Just like how the CIA who roused up the HKers, they weren't doing this to make HK-US relations better. They were never doing this to cement good relations with the US. They were doing this to wreak havoc in HK society. They don't even care if it back fires and HK people ends up hating US more. As long as HK society become more divided, the US's goal is achieved.

Now we have the taxi driver's side of the story. The taxi driver claimed that two rioters climbed into his taxi and tried to take control of the steering wheel that caused the taxi to lose control and slam into the crowd.



真相 深水埗的哥被暴徒搶軚失控

【大公報訊】前日長沙灣有的士司機遭暴徒「私了」爆頭，至今仍然留院；暴徒昨日竟發起到醫院滋擾受傷司機，傍晚開始該司機病房門外開始有警員駐守。有的士業界組織引述該司機女兒覆述事發經過，暴徒先是打破的士前後及側鏡玻璃，其後有人爬上車搶軚，以致的士撞到人。汽車交通運輸業總工會發聲明譴責示威者濫用私刑，促請政府盡快制定措施恢復社會安寧。

司機及家人遭「起底」

　　暴徒前日在長沙灣政府合署附近進行非法集會及遊行，其間一輛的士發生交通事故，暴徒打砸破壞的士車身，的士司機更被揪出車外圍毆至重創，頭破血流。的士司機從業員總會理事會總監李為民引述該司機女兒稱，涉事司機至今仍然留醫，需要縫十多針，又指暴徒正對司機及其家人進行「起底」。

　　李為民又引述司機向女兒覆述事發經過，還原當天所謂「撞人」真相。女兒引述父親稱，當時暴徒指責他阻礙架設路障，打破的士的前後及側鏡玻璃，他打了一通電話，對方着他將車駛去送修，當他想離開時，有暴徒爬上車搶軚，才導致車輛失控撞到人。其他暴徒見狀立刻失控，拉他下車毆打，更有人想用斧頭襲擊他。

片段拍到兩暴徒從車門爬出

　　網上流傳一條高角度拍攝當時情況的片段，顯示的士車頭乘客位置車門被暴徒打開，之後的士才失控撞向人群。亦有片段顯示，撞車後那一刻，的士左邊車門有兩名暴徒爬出，由此可見是誰襲擊司機導致車禍，與司機女兒講法脗合。

　　汽車交通運輸業總工會的士司機分會發聲明，指該會知悉事件後，第一時間跟進及了解情況，並向司機及其家屬致以慰問，會方強烈譴責暴徒無法無天，濫用私刑暴力對待的士司機，並促請政府盡快制定措施恢復社會安寧，讓的士司機能在安全情況下工作，又呼籲的士司機出行時注意自身及乘客安全，如遇突發情況冷靜處理，避免發生衝突。

In the past day, taxi driver in Cheung Sha Wan was smack on the head and still stayed in hospital. The mobs yesterday rushed to the hospital to harass the injured driver. In the evening, police officers were stationed outside the driver's ward. A taxi trade organization quoted the driver's daughter as a retell of the incident. The mob first broke the front and back of the taxi and the side mirror glass. Later, someone climbed into the car and tried to take control of the steering wheel, causing the taxi to hit people. The Automobile and Transportation Industry General Union issued a statement condemning the abuse of lynching by demonstrators and urging the government to formulate measures to restore social peace as soon as possible.

Drivers and family members personal information was leaked and revealed by the rioters.

On the day before, the mobs illegally gathered and marched near the Cheung Sha Wan Government Offices. A taxi accident occurred. The mobs smashed the taxi body and the taxi drivers were grabbed out of the car and beaten badly. Li Weimin, director of the Taxi Drivers' Practitioners Association, quoted the driver's daughter as saying that the driver still stayed in the hospital and needed to sew more than ten needles. He also said that the mobs are going after the driver and his family.

Li Weimin also quoted the driver's daughter and her recap of what the taxi driver side of the incident and to restore the truth of the so-called "ramming into people" on the day. The daughter quoted the father as saying that the mob accused him of obstructing the roadblock, breaking the front and back of the taxi and the side mirror glass. The driver made a call and the person on the phone asked him to drive his taxi to the repair shop. When he wanted to leave, the mob climbed onto the car. The mob tried to take control of the steering wheel and caused the vehicle to run out of control and hit people. Other mobs immediately lost control, pulled him off the taxi and beat him, and some people wanted to attack him with an axe.


The clip captured two thugs climbing out of the car door

A high-angle photograph of the situation at the time was recorded on the Internet, showing that the front door of the taxi passenger was opened by the mob, and then the taxi was out of control and slammed into the crowd. There are also clips showing that at the moment after the crash, two mobs climbed out of the left door of the taxi. This shows that who attacked the driver caused a car accident and concurred with the driver's daughter description of the incident.

I feel like one reason things has gone so out of control is Carrie Lam. The rioters see a woman leader and think she's a pushover. They simply assume that she's a slave to the CCP.

Jura said:

the events according to the SCMP article I linked above:
"In Sham Shui Po, a taxi driver in his 60s rammed into a crowd of protesters and injured a woman. Angry masked groups then pulled the driver out of the car and beat him, before he was later rescued by firefighters. Beaten unconscious, his face and head were covered in blood while the windows of the taxi were smashed."

(hope it's obvious I'm unable to comment on this occasion)

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SCMP reporting is known to have an anti-China and pro-rioter slant.

SinoSoldier said:

An insightful interview with Steve Bannon on Hong Kong and its importance within the US-China economic nexus. He also gives his standpoint on why China has been reluctant to use heavy-handed tactics on HK protesters and why the city matters to the PRC more than mainlanders wish to believe.

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You got all that from this two-and-a-half minute clip? I'm pretty sure he didn't say all that.

Xsizor said:

My take on the taxi-driver incident:
1. He might have been a mainlander/ mandarinspeaker. But he was at the wrong place at the wrong time and was heckled by the mob. The rioters are aware of the Pro-Beijing stance of many taxi drivers (who may be mainland native) so it is quite logical that they saw the enemy in this driver.
2. A taxi car is the livelihood of the taxi-driver. It is his bread and livelihood. The rioters may have started attacking it/ there was a chance of damage. Anyway, he lost his calm and decided to scurry back. He might have got his foot wrong at the pedals even. Anyway, I don't think it was deliberate. The vehicle didn't have the speed and it was executing a turn as if it was a desperate attempt to flee.
3. It isn't Charlottesville. But there is a high chance that this incident could be portrayed as one to further incite the protestors. A charlottsville type attacker would have only one thing in mind - inflict maximum damage/ hurt on the crowd. He would need to have his foot shoved hard down on the accelerator and make sure that he keeps the steering wheel steady and straight so that the vehicle may plough through the crowd. Sorta like Billiards.
4. Rioters killing the individual/ hurting the individual is an entirely different matter. That is not self-defence ; it is street justice and mob-rule.
5. I think that @SinoSoldier has some valid points regarding Steve Bannon and his comments. As much as the american MSM may potray Brietbart as a fringe media, the reality is that Brietbart is NOT a fringe media but rather a very big outlet of news source for a very large demography within United States. ( non-hispanic white , middle aged , pro NRA, pro-Military, Reagan -Trump Republican males). So Bannon - even if considered an exile and a nuisance - is NOT one to be discounted completely for either his words or his stance regarding any Issue. Steve Bannon is like the Tucker Carlson of Fox News which caters to a bigger demographic that is center right to Far right (unlike Brietbart which is Far to extreme right). Steve Bannon is quite the powerful voice and his views are taken seriously by a large demography. A demography that includes the American military. The American military servicemen does NOT tune into TLC channel and humm Kumbaya. They tune into Fox News and Brietbart for "news".

CONFIRMATION BIAS is a big thing folks. CONFIRMATION BIAS.

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You are overestimating the demographic size and influence of the US far right. The US military is also definitely not that dominated by the far right otherwise both the US and the world would be in much worse shape.

supersnoop said:

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I have a theory on this, maybe others have some thoughts.
I would bet that many of the "pro-democracy" supporters overseas are local-born Chinese millennials. I would bet extra that they have almost no knowledge of Chinese history and are also not literate at all in Chinese.

I must admit, I am not fully literate myself, but I know enough to read a menu, headlines, that sort of thing. I suspect that the lack of knowledge means that they do not fully appreciate being "Chinese". To put it simply, if you aren't interested in your own language, its easy to not care about the real history (and not just the eurocentric version).

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There is definitely truth to your theory, I have observed the same in my personal interactions. For example through general conversation I found that a Hong Konger friend who is an ardent critic of the PRC doesn't even know all the provinces in China. The lack of knowledge of Chinese culture and history is not limited to millennials though, under British colonial rule many Hong Kong students have to choose between studying Chinese and Chinese History or a Western foreign language such as French or Spanish and Eurocentric "world" history. The latter combination was held in higher regard by many locals due to the relative rarity, supposed difficulty because it's different, perceived demand in higher status social circles/better job prospects, and mere affiliation with the colonial rulers, exactly as the colonial rulers wanted.

jimmyjames30x30 said:

I call Bannon a scammer, because he said something like "been to Shanghai and Beijing several times" to imply that he knows China enough to know how to deal with China better than those real China-experts who have totally different ideas about China.

It's like a non-Chinese person try to sell a recipe book on Chinese food he wrote, and put in his introduction: "I am not a cook, but I know Chinese food, because I've been to my Chinese friend's place several times and went to his kitchen to look at how he made food a few times." Would you actually keep reading this book? For the most American, this is perhaps enough, because they would perceive this guys as having more knowledge about Chinese food than they do.

Now imagine a country, in which the average person trust a scammer like that more than professional cooks that has gone through strict culinary training and education, on top of having years of experience running a successful restaurant business in Chinese food. This is the kind of environment that enables Bannon the scammer to earn a decent living, and even enjoys months holding a high positions in a top government position.

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That's the kind of environment that got Trump elected president. But let's not ignore other major factors in play such as a co-opted political class that chooses to serve big money special interests instead of the people.

enroger said:

I've never understood this so called "Color Revolution" until I'm seeing one up close. Those rioters are extremely well organized, far too organized for them to be just a bunch of disgruntled citizen, too organized even for them to be organized by certain political party. Their operational sophistication just about match one that is orchestrated by an intelligence agency, they are targeting key city infrastructure now.

It is clear to me that their goal was never about getting some sort of concession from the government, if the government agree to some of the terms then the rioters will simply come up with more and more ridiculous demand, reconciliation is impossible because they don't want any.

This is not how someone would act to bring about change, this is how someone would act if all they want to achieve is maximum disruption. Simple analysis in motives and means will tell you who is really behind this all.

It is funny that just when China is almost about to achieve parity with US in terms of conventional war fighting abilities, a whole new form of warfare emerged where China is again light years behind the US. Social engineering warfare, social media warfare, mass psychology manipulation ...etc, I bet CCP haven't even heard of those things.

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China is nowhere near achieving parity with the US in terms of conventional warfighting abilities. These riots in HK are also nothing new, standard colonialist tactics. Indeed China is unfamiliar with waging this kind of hybrid warfare because it isn't a colonialist invader however it is adept at countering it from its own decolonization experience, which of course this is a part of.

Bannon was run out of Europe where he was taking credit for the rise of the right there. Axios interviewed and followed around Steve Bannon and they also interviewed some the candidates he was taking credit for their rise. They said they never heard of him or they met him once. Now he's back in the US with tail tucked in between legs.