H-20 bomber (with H-X, JH-XX)

Hub

New Member
Registered Member
the point is not the swing wing. the point is in having a plane with the role of medium ranged tactical strike with heavy munitions at relatively low cost (
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, about ~3x cheaper with inflation).

The F-111 wasn't made for the swing wing. The F-111 was made for a specific ground attack objective at a given production cost, build time and maintenance footprint, the swing wing was the method used to get there.

A JH-XX with ~3500 km combat radius, M1.6 max speed, integrated with 500-1000 km range cruise missiles, the LO characteristics of a J-20 and most of all, the cost of a J-20, using 2x afterburning WS-15s with same TWR as the F-111, would be absolutely a formidable opponent and be able to fuck shit up while being extremely tricky to catch.

How do you catch something that goes the same speed as your planes, can see and launch at your ships from 500 km out, but you can't see it until you're 50 km in?

Unlike subsonics, you can't vector towards the launch point and hope to catch up to it because by the time you get there it has sprinted away yet still out of detection range of both radar and IRST.

And then even if you do shoot it down, there's 200-300 more. With the cost and dimensions of a fighter, it can be pumped out in fighter numbers (300+) rather than bomber numbers (~100).
And another merit: since it mainly undertakes tactical tasks, the chain of command can be greatly shortened. Unlike strategic bombers such as the B2, the JH-XX can be controlled by the theater command. It can significantly increase the reaction speed.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
And another merit: since it mainly undertakes tactical tasks, the chain of command can be greatly shortened. Unlike strategic bombers such as the B2, the JH-XX can be controlled by the theater command. It can significantly increase the reaction speed.
another very interesting possibility: the F-111 was carrier capable, at least somewhat. Nothing says a JH-XX can't be made carrier capable either.

many people here are thinking "oh we need something that can reach NA and back." One way to do that is with a very big and heavy plane. But another is to move the airbase closer.
 

CrazyHorse

Junior Member
Registered Member
the point is not the swing wing. the point is in having a plane with the role of medium ranged tactical strike with heavy munitions at relatively low cost (
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
vs
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
, about ~3x cheaper with inflation).

The F-111 wasn't made for the swing wing. The F-111 was made for a specific ground attack objective at a given production cost, build time and maintenance footprint, the swing wing was the method used to get there.

A JH-XX with ~3500 km combat radius, M1.6 max speed, integrated with 500-1000 km range cruise missiles, the LO characteristics of a J-20 and most of all, the cost of a J-20, using 2x afterburning WS-15s with same TWR as the F-111, would be absolutely a formidable opponent and be able to fuck shit up while being extremely tricky to catch.

How do you catch something that goes the same speed as your planes, can see and launch at your ships from 500 km out, but you can't see it until you're 50 km in?

Unlike subsonics, you can't vector towards the launch point and hope to catch up to it because by the time you get there it has sprinted away yet still out of detection range of both radar and IRST.

And then even if you do shoot it down, there's 200-300 more. With the cost and dimensions of a fighter, it can be pumped out in fighter numbers (300+) rather than bomber numbers (~100).
I would hope they could get better stealth than the j-20, with new coatings and it not having to take maneuverability into consideration.
 
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latenlazy

Brigadier
another very interesting possibility: the F-111 was carrier capable, at least somewhat. Nothing says a JH-XX can't be made carrier capable either.

many people here are thinking "oh we need something that can reach NA and back." One way to do that is with a very big and heavy plane. But another is to move the airbase closer.
If you want the JH-XX to be lobbing highly capable antiship missiles from internal bays it will be bigger than the F-111 and not carrier capable.

Operating carriers within range of the North American coast would require levels of basing support in the Pacific China will not have for a long time, if ever. This thread is not a fantasy grab bag for a do everything bomber. This is a thread about the H-20 and potential JH-XX. Let’s try to keep discussion realistic please.
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
If you want the JH-XX to be lobbing highly capable antiship missiles from internal bays it will be bigger than the F-111 and not carrier capable.

Operating carriers within range of the North American coast would require levels of basing support in the Pacific China will not have for a long time, if ever. This thread is not a fantasy grab bag for a do everything bomber. This is a thread about the H-20 and potential JH-XX. Let’s try to keep discussion realistic please.
it's just as unrealistic as something that can round trip from China to NA which is what someone else was asking about. it's an exercise in absurdity.

I don't actually think being able to reach NA without refueling (whether from an airbase or a carrier) should even be a consideration.
 

latenlazy

Brigadier
it's just as unrealistic as something that can round trip from China to NA which is what someone else was asking about. it's an exercise in absurdity.

I don't actually think being able to reach NA without refueling (whether from an airbase or a carrier) should even be a consideration.
It shouldn’t be. Which is why we do t need to keep riffing about it :p
 

TK3600

Major
Registered Member
it's just as unrealistic as something that can round trip from China to NA which is what someone else was asking about. it's an exercise in absurdity.

I don't actually think being able to reach NA without refueling (whether from an airbase or a carrier) should even be a consideration.
Can B-2 do it?
 

obj 705A

Junior Member
Registered Member
The distance from Shanghai to California's coastline is about 6,000 nmi (nautical miles). A round trip flight would be 12,000 nmi. You want to do this without aerial refueling?
It's going to take a plane running on Liquid Hydrogen to make that distance.

Maybe 20 years from now the Chinese will build such a plane, but it's definitely NOT going to happen right now.
If the route goes from shenyang or somewhere near it through the pacific to the center of Oregon then the distance is 8800km.

If the route is from the more northen parts of China through a massive portion of Russian airspace & the north pole to New York the distance is about 10000km.

If the combat radius of the H-20 is 6000km (similar to that of the Tu-160 or perhaps a little bit less) and the range of it's cruise missile is about 3000km then it should reach US costoal areas without having to refuel and still have enough fuel to go back.
If it's combat radius is 6000km and the range of it's missiles is 4000km then it should be able to reach NY provided it would have to go through a massive portion of Russian airspace. Though I guess if it does take the shortest route to NY through the center of the Russian airspace then it could refuel anyway since it would be probably safe there from US fighters.

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jerometa

Just Hatched
Registered Member
And another merit: since it mainly undertakes tactical tasks, the chain of command can be greatly shortened. Unlike strategic bombers such as the B2, the JH-XX can be controlled by the theater command. It can significantly increase the reaction speed.
The point you are saying that F-111B was conceived as a carrier-based plane. In fact, it was intended to be a interceptor capable of engaging Soviet Bomber. Later, the program was cancelled, the Navy chose F-14 to replace F-111 as it is more maneuverable. The upgrading of the fighter allowed it to be limited strategic bomber for the air force.
 

charles18

Junior Member
Registered Member
If the route goes from shenyang or somewhere near it through the pacific to the center of Oregon then the distance is 8800km.

If the route is from the more northen parts of China through a massive portion of Russian airspace & the north pole to New York the distance is about 10000km.

If the combat radius of the H-20 is 6000km (similar to that of the Tu-160 or perhaps a little bit less) and the range of it's cruise missile is about 3000km then it should reach US costoal areas without having to refuel and still have enough fuel to go back.
If it's combat radius is 6000km and the range of it's missiles is 4000km then it should be able to reach NY provided it would have to go through a massive portion of Russian airspace. Though I guess if it does take the shortest route to NY through the center of the Russian airspace then it could refuel anyway since it would be probably safe there from US fighters.
I could talk some more but I'll stop right here. It is getting off topic.
 
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