H-20 bomber (with H-X, JH-XX)

Xsizor said:

He is taking the approximate figures for just the frontal RCS using the information from the Lockheed promotion that touted the frontal RCS of F-22 as 0.0001m2.

Click to expand...

I don't recall seeing any LockMart material that cites that figure, not that LockMart can be trusted. I think 0.0001 is a urban legend and has been variously cited for F-22, B-2, and so on.

Xsizor said:

He is taking the approximate figures for just the frontal RCS using the information from the Lockheed promotion that touted the frontal RCS of F-22 as 0.0001m2.

With DSI and metamaterials ( which F-35 indeed does have) it should be lower. But I've noticed that many pro-US individuals trying to prop up F-22 as having superiority over F-35 or any other aircraft in stealth. It isn't one based on facts or information though - just emotional. They'd want to have their primary heavy air superiority fighter not be shown lacking even though it uses technology from 1980s to 1990s. Understandable.

Click to expand...

We also have RCS studies by the Chinese and so on for the F-35, which is implying a minimum RCS around -50 dBsm.

This isn't the study I'm looking for; there's one where you can see a drop to -50 dBsm, but it's showing about -40 dBsm (minimum) without RAM. Subtracting another 10 dBsm for RAM is feasible, but the point is, the F-35 can be extremely stealthy vs a single emitter if it's desired.


When it comes to F-35 vs F-22, the F-35 has an advantage in being significantly smaller, first, and it also has an advantage in having a decade newer RAM.

Not sure how reliable source here is but apart from the usual posturing language I guess it means H-20 will feature higher payload and overall bigger dimensions than the B-21 Raider. Which at least to me isn't all that surprising.

para80 said:

Not sure how reliable source here is but apart from the usual posturing language I guess it means H-20 will feature higher payload and overall bigger dimensions than the B-21 Raider. Which at least to me isn't all that surprising.View attachment 75095

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Click to expand...

Fan Qianshao didn't say anything interesting or newly-breaking.

H-20 will be similar to B-2 size-wise, but closer to B-21 technology-wise. None of these are particularly surprising or revealing.

Key high-level parameters and design specs to look for: stealth, range, payload, and avionics.

Stealth - the near consensus is that H-20 is fly wing design; little details beyond that are known other than some artistic and speculative rendering.

Range & payload - there are tradeoffs between the two within a certain limit; they're largely determined by the engine choice. Engine choices are limited and potential candidates are WS-10, WS-18, or WS-15. The most likely choice is WS-10 w/o after-burner. As a reference, B-2's respective specs: range 11,000km, payload 18,000kg-23,000kg, and engine F-118-GE-100 non after-burning.

Avionics - this is probably the most interesting part, but is also most difficult to know. This is the area where most advances are made since B-2 of 30 years ago.

by78 said:

Where did you get F-35 RCS figure from? Are you making stuff up again?

Click to expand...

The tennis ball or marble size RCS is present only at a few frontal angles. When you average the RCS from the rest of the aircraft then it is far less impressive. The presence of vertical slabs means that none of the currently flying fifth generation fighters has true all aspect stealth, hence the speculation that they would be removed for the sixth gen.

para80 said:

Not sure how reliable source here is but apart from the usual posturing language I guess it means H-20 will feature higher payload and overall bigger dimensions than the B-21 Raider. Which at least to me isn't all that surprising.View attachment 75095

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

Click to expand...

Indeed … the question is only since it is again an official mentioning of that type, when will we see it?
IMO it is once again part of the - as we as in Germany - Salami-Taktik to step by step reveal something … but at least some day they need to show it. So when is this date?

Deino said:

Indeed … the question is only since it is again an official mentioning of that type, when will we see it?
IMO it is once again part of the - as we as in Germany - Salami-Taktik to step by step reveal something … but at least some day they need to show it. So when is this date?

Click to expand...

Indeed, my thoughts exactly re the salami slicing messaging. Then again H-20 as strategic asset may be so sensitive we wont see any reveal until well after first flight. I guess our first look at it may be from some commercial satellite imagery.

para80 said:

Indeed, my thoughts exactly re the salami slicing messaging. Then again H-20 as strategic asset may be so sensitive we wont see any reveal until well after first flight. I guess our first look at it may be from some commercial satellite imagery.

Click to expand...

Agreed .. but when? How close to prototype finished and roll out are they? Months or even years away?

I'm leaning towards a year or two at least, but then again that's a complete stab in the dark based on the hearsay we all read. I just don't expect anything this year at all tbh.