future plaaf's flanker upgrade

chinawhite · Oct 10, 2005

MadMax said:
unstable? the SU series is unstable with or without canards without fbw it would bee imposible to fly the canards make it more unstable and that makes it more manuverable

Nope that is not how a unstable airframe works.

It steers the air in different dirctions. while changing the airframe distorts the movement of air

you just need to slighly redesign the front. i never siad bolt em on...

[/quote]

THe Su-35s that were built were built NEW not upgrades of other aircraft

MIGleader · Oct 10, 2005

chinawhite said:
Nope that is not how a unstable airframe works.

It steers the air in different dirctions. while changing the airframe distorts the movement of air

THe Su-35s that were built were built NEW not upgrades of other aircraft[/QUOTE]

so your telling me they arnt su-27 upgrades?! lol. well, in a sense, they were new aircraft, but by no means a completely novel ort original design. aside from the canards, improved al-31, 4 more wepons pylons, and new cocpit and radar, the plane is 80% su-27. lets not argue. so, why do you think china cant modify the su-27s to feature canards? it may not be easy as boting em on, buy it sure is possible.

Chairman Hu · Oct 10, 2005

yea know, i gotta agree with MiGLeader...

Just redo the front and add a MUCH more powerful FBW system to balance it out, plus 4 xtra pylons always sound good, the Su-37 carries 14 missile... ai...

Su-35 IS an UPGRADE of the Su-27, it was even designated are the Su-27M

adeptitus · Oct 10, 2005

Chairman Hu said:
yea know, i gotta agree with MiGLeader...
Just redo the front and add a MUCH more powerful FBW system to balance it out, plus 4 xtra pylons always sound good, the Su-37 carries 14 missile... ai...
Su-35 IS an UPGRADE of the Su-27, it was even designated are the Su-27M

If the goal is to arm the plane with more missiles, wouldn't it be easier to just upgrade the pylons to carry multiple missiles each? The outer-wing pylons have low weight limit, but the wing-root ones should do fine with 2 or 3 missiles.

maddogy4645 · Oct 10, 2005

Hi Guys! I've been busy studing for my midterm exams so I was absent from this forum for a while.

I got some questions and a comment:

-The canard upgrades while possible, do not improve the current fleet of Flankers sufficiently to justify their costs. The upgrades should be focused on where they're truly needed, and those are the radars, the precision attack capabilities, and long range AAMs.

-Now that we know that WS-10A is probably ready, will they be actually used on Flankers in the PLAAF? I sense the need to ask the question when I thought about what exactly was stated on the Flanker contracts between China and Russia. Did the Russians permit PLAAF to use indiginous parts? What % of parts can be indiginous? If Russia did permit China, was that because Russia never expected China to indiginously design a AL31 class engine this quick? If China builds more J11s with nearly 100% components, do they need a license from Russia? If this is actually illegal, will China purchase more license or simply ignore the Russian response? Will Russia retaliate by oil embargo on China?

tphuang · Oct 11, 2005

maddogy4645 said:
Hi Guys! I've been busy studing for my midterm exams so I was absent from this forum for a while.

I got some questions and a comment:

-The canard upgrades while possible, do not improve the current fleet of Flankers sufficiently to justify their costs. The upgrades should be focused on where they're truly needed, and those are the radars, the precision attack capabilities, and long range AAMs.

-Now that we know that WS-10A is probably ready, will they be actually used on Flankers in the PLAAF? I sense the need to ask the question when I thought about what exactly was stated on the Flanker contracts between China and Russia. Did the Russians permit PLAAF to use indiginous parts? What % of parts can be indiginous? If Russia did permit China, was that because Russia never expected China to indiginously design a AL31 class engine this quick? If China builds more J11s with nearly 100% components, do they need a license from Russia? If this is actually illegal, will China purchase more license or simply ignore the Russian response? Will Russia retaliate by oil embargo on China?

not sure the legality of contract, but J11B is suppose to be 100% indigenous. I'm sure SAC and Sukhoi worked something out, so Sukhoi still gets a cut out of every J11 being produced.

chinawhite · Oct 11, 2005

Su-27

Wing Span: 14.70 m
Wing area: 62 m2
Wing Aspect Ratio: 3.5
Length: 21.93 m
Height: 5.93 m
Empty Weight: 22500 kg / 17000 kg
Max.Weight: 30000 kg

Su-35

Wing Span: 15.16 m
Length: 21.96 m
Height: 6.84 m
Wing Area: 62 m2
Empty Weight: 18400 kg
Max.Weight: 34000 kg

.

its not just the front bit that is different

so your telling me they arnt su-27 upgrades?! lol. well, in a sense, they were new aircraft, but by no means a completely novel ort original design.

The su-35s that were produced were not upgraded su-27.(this is what you want to do)

They were produced from scratch. Nothing that was old or second hand.

The su-35 is not a upgrade package but a improved/modifed su-27

aside from the canards, improved al-31, 4 more wepons pylons, and new cocpit and radar, the plane is 80% su-27. lets not argue. so, why do you think china cant modify the su-27s to feature canards? it may not be easy as boting em on, buy it sure is possible.

Of cause it is possible but not using the su-35 as a blue-print

vincelee · Oct 11, 2005

don't you love armchair generals who have never taken an engineering class in their lives? I sure do, for the countless hours of amusement.

chinawhite · Oct 11, 2005

vincelee said:
don't you love armchair generals who have never taken an engineering class in their lives? I sure do, for the countless hours of amusement.

Armchair general?

And who may you be, general

vincelee · Oct 11, 2005

I was actually referring to lil' Miglet, but oh well.

future plaaf's flanker upgrade

chinawhite

Banned Idiot

MIGleader

Banned Idiot

Chairman Hu

Banned Idiot

adeptitus

Captain

maddogy4645

New Member

tphuang

Lieutenant General

chinawhite

Banned Idiot

vincelee

Junior Member

chinawhite

Banned Idiot

vincelee

Junior Member