Jura The idiot
General
what is it you're saying, does the F-35 have flares or not now?
F-35 Joint Strike Fighter News, Videos and pics Thread
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TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
Jura The idiot
General
meant to ask about "chaffs" not "flares" sorry
so the F-35 doesn't have any chaffs at all now?
Brumby
Major
Not yet according to the article although I am not surprised by it. I believe "chaffs" are not effective against modern radar seekers and would not be a priority for the F-35. The one planned for the F-35 according to the AWST is an "advanced chaff" scheduled for delivery in 2020. The ARM-210 (chaff) is basically a backup for the ALE-70 FOTD..
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
Maybe.
That’s the best I can give you. Maybe.
F35 is supposed to have the ARM210 Advanced Radar counter Measures. However the USAF is still doing Testing and is slated to enter service in 2020.
ARM 210 countermeasures, should be close to the current chaff used in the USAF in size and configuration for launching but because of the launchers location and other differences F35’s launcher may not be compatible or it could be with existing systems.
As pointed to in the article a 2014 catalog by a Chaff maker claimed to have F22 and F35 compatable training Chaff dispenser. Which is why I think they may have a ALE 52 based launcher.
It may be able to in the interim use existing Chaff but to a lesser effect.
That said F22 literature says that it has a “Tailored” Chaff countermeasure. Which leads me to Maybe.
F35 appears to have 5 countermeasures to attack.
First the VLO shaping and materials.
Then the Radar’s ability to attack electronically.
Then Flares to try and spoof IR guided weapons.
These three it has in common with F22.
Then comes The Towed decoy ALE 70 however the more I read of it the more it seems to be for spoofing Ground to Air Missiles, rather than Air to Air.
This is where ARM210 comes in.
If a bandit was able to get on a F35’s six o’clock and fire a Radar guided missile the Chaff is popped and the pilot starts maneuvering.
This isn’t world war 2 clearly so the Chaff in this case has been updated as best possible the goal not be blind the missile but to attempt and buy time well the fighter and missile shift as to make it impossible for the missile to reacquire the Lightning by it being in a position where it can’t turn hard enough to intercept or the radar angle is poor and the radar can’t get a good track. Hopefully then the Lightning can break the situation around and go Smokey on that Bandit...
That’s the best I can give you. Maybe.
F35 is supposed to have the ARM210 Advanced Radar counter Measures. However the USAF is still doing Testing and is slated to enter service in 2020.
ARM 210 countermeasures, should be close to the current chaff used in the USAF in size and configuration for launching but because of the launchers location and other differences F35’s launcher may not be compatible or it could be with existing systems.
As pointed to in the article a 2014 catalog by a Chaff maker claimed to have F22 and F35 compatable training Chaff dispenser. Which is why I think they may have a ALE 52 based launcher.
It may be able to in the interim use existing Chaff but to a lesser effect.
That said F22 literature says that it has a “Tailored” Chaff countermeasure. Which leads me to Maybe.
F35 appears to have 5 countermeasures to attack.
First the VLO shaping and materials.
Then the Radar’s ability to attack electronically.
Then Flares to try and spoof IR guided weapons.
These three it has in common with F22.
Then comes The Towed decoy ALE 70 however the more I read of it the more it seems to be for spoofing Ground to Air Missiles, rather than Air to Air.
This is where ARM210 comes in.
If a bandit was able to get on a F35’s six o’clock and fire a Radar guided missile the Chaff is popped and the pilot starts maneuvering.
This isn’t world war 2 clearly so the Chaff in this case has been updated as best possible the goal not be blind the missile but to attempt and buy time well the fighter and missile shift as to make it impossible for the missile to reacquire the Lightning by it being in a position where it can’t turn hard enough to intercept or the radar angle is poor and the radar can’t get a good track. Hopefully then the Lightning can break the situation around and go Smokey on that Bandit...
Mar 1, 2019
sort of update from inside of
:
"In other news, the head of Air Force acquisition, Will Roper, told me that the attempt to rebuild F-35’s maintenance and mission planning system known as ALIS as a cluster of apps is “going well, actually.”
However, the nascent effort is still an experiment at Nellis AFB run by software team known as Mad Hatter. The next step is, Roper said, for the Navy to decide if Mad Hatter should continue to work on what may become a substantial rebuild of ALIS, which has become perhaps the most troubled part of the F-35 program. That decision will be up to the Navy’s James Geurts, assistant secretary for research, development and acquisition, who now has acquisition authority for the F-35."
plus the picture of quote unquote tablet:
That is not a tablet, but a Panasonic Toughbook PC ,just for reference.
Maybe there is a misunderstanding by the reporter, and the "software that automate the user input over several database and using automated decision tree" interpreted as " tablet with apps".
Radar can't be used, the emission of it can guide any missile made in the past half century onto the aircraft.
Chaf has limited use as well, it can fool only the non-Doppler seekers. , and gives away the position of the airplane at the moment of launch.
Against radar guided weapons the towed decoy usable only, that has the same speed like the jet.
But it can fight against only one radar at the time, and it can be hard to fight against multi-band radar systems ( if not impossible ) .
Jura The idiot
General
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
Only against missile systems that are that sophisticated. Additionally the radar on F22 and F35 can shift frequency and mode but operates in the X band. Other weapons and systems may be used to try and pick off radars as they go. Leaving the X band.
which is why it’s a last resort. And most missiles are still non Doppler types as it’s a disposable radar. The aim of Chaff is to buy time.
it’s being towed by the jet so it has the same speed.
F35 don’t operate as single ships you would have a flight of four operating in pairs.
Furthermore other assets may also be used in the SEAD role like the MALD J or drones to fill the air with additional targets and assets. The data links of these beaming the radar source to the F35 who attacks them kinetically with stand off weapons.
Radars using coded signals, so missile has to be able to interpret the radar coded illumination .
These are the most primitive semi-active missile.
Means to sort out the Doppler is a trivial things, it come out from the system as a stable error signal.
The small drones and company hasn't got big enough directional antenna, means they have limited capability to sort out the "real" radar signal from all other RF signals.
Size is king, the F35 very small compared to the ground based radars, and the drones / baits are even smaller than the F35/22.