F-35 Joint Strike Fighter News, Videos and pics Thread

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator

As a full blown JSF partner, Canada made a commitment to buy JSF, if they don't buy JSF, they lose the contracts, its black and white. As a Partner, that implies a commitment to purchase the "F-35. Canada abandoned its commitment due to pressure from liberals who lack an understanding of the threat Canada faces, and Justin Trudeau is a typical liberal who will lead Canada back to 4th gen aircraft, which will not only be not survivable given the future threat, but also not a partner in bringing this aircraft into service.

JSF contracts were and are commited to Partners, full Partners, not folks trying to game the system. Canada and the JSF partners entered into an agreement, and contracts are based on commitment!
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
As a full blown JSF partner, Canada made a commitment to buy JSF, if they don't buy JSF, they lose the contracts, its black and white. As a Partner, that implies a commitment to purchase the "F-35. Canada abandoned its commitment due to pressure from liberals who lack an understanding of the threat Canada faces, and Justin Trudeau is a typical liberal who will lead Canada back to 4th gen aircraft, which will not only be not survivable given the future threat, but also not a partner in bringing this aircraft into service.

JSF contracts were and are commited to Partners, full Partners, not folks trying to game the system. Canada and the JSF partners entered into an agreement, and contracts are based on commitment!

Who's gonna invade Canada? Only the Russian has the bombers to reach our population down south, but they have no reason to bomb or invade us. The only scenario is when they want to get at the Yanks, in which case you guys got all the cool toys to stop them
 

Brumby

Major
As a full blown JSF partner, Canada made a commitment to buy JSF, if they don't buy JSF, they lose the contracts, its black and white. As a Partner, that implies a commitment to purchase the "F-35. Canada abandoned its commitment due to pressure from liberals who lack an understanding of the threat Canada faces, and Justin Trudeau is a typical liberal who will lead Canada back to 4th gen aircraft, which will not only be not survivable given the future threat, but also not a partner in bringing this aircraft into service.

JSF contracts were and are commited to Partners, full Partners, not folks trying to game the system. Canada and the JSF partners entered into an agreement, and contracts are based on commitment!
The problem is not as clear cut once the details are examined. The Canadians are arguing that access to F-35 contracts is conditional based on being a JSF partner and that means paying an annual retainer fee which the Canadians are in compliance. Committing to purchase was not part of the fine print to have access to the contracts although one would deem such argument as not behaving in good faith. In any case, choosing SH as an interim buy does not necessarily preclude future purchase of F-35's given some of the publicly known issues leading to Block 3F completion. Should LM pursue a scorched earth policy, it will seriously undermine future relationships.
 

Zool

Junior Member
I think LM's position at this stage is posturing to put some heat on Canada's plan to go with Super Hornet. Given that the present Canadian government has politically cornered itself, going with an interim buy with the SH is probably a good stop gap solution until the F-35 program fully delivers and likely with a lower unit cost down the road. It is also prudent to wire the F-18's with EA capabilities like what the Australians did. Regardless of what LM is saying, I think the F-35 will benefit from being supported by full spectrum EA capabilities especially when the NG pods become available.

I completely agree.

LM's position does appear to be a pressure move but I don't think the JSF program agreement stipulates a mandatory buy or how many that would even entail from what I have been able to find, and as some of the commentators have already noted in the reporting. Canada brings a cost competitive aerospace industry to the table with security clearances that are found among a handful of countries. I imagine it would continue to bid on work share on that basis, however things unfold, and LM may be shooting itself in the foot here.

SH's in Growler configuration or wired for conversion down the road would be a smart decision. Selling it that way, especially the Growler, would be the tricky part...

Canadian Foreign Policy and Canadian's themselves are adverse to operations involving strikes on indirect 'enemies' based on geopolitics and resources (ex. Iraq) but are supportive of allies when they have come under direct attack (ex. 9/11 & Afghanistan). The preference is to focus on North American Defence, and with the Liberals back in power they are questioning the need for the F-35 which from the beginning was billed as a stealth strike aircraft. The F-22 as an air-superiority fighter would have been the ideal aircraft for Canada and North America overall.

What LM and advocates within the Canadian Forces need to do is really sell the air-air side of the F-35, the stealth benefits in BVR engagement, the situational awareness F-35 sensors will bring to the airspace and how Growlers bought now, can support those kind of operations by jamming foreign AWACS and missiles. Take the focus off penetrating foreign ADS.
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Who's gonna invade Canada? Only the Russian has the bombers to reach our population down south, but they have no reason to bomb or invade us. The only scenario is when they want to get at the Yanks, in which case you guys got all the cool toys to stop them
Canada And The US have a Treaty alliance for continental Air Space Defence. Under Treaty Canada and the Us must maintain at least a minimum of Air forces with high commonality of systems. This was originally established for the Cold war however in the post 9/11 world it is also part of continental Air security, and S&R additionally despite What you might think any Russian attack on the US would pass over the pole and through Canadian Air space with attacks on Canadian targets either Directly or indirectly via fallout.
Despite what You might think Vincent. The US and Canada are linked at the hip. any attack on one will fall on to the other.
 

vincent

Grumpy Old Man
Staff member
Moderator - World Affairs
Canada And The US have a Treaty alliance for continental Air Space Defence. Under Treaty Canada and the Us must maintain at least a minimum of Air forces with high commonality of systems. This was originally established for the Cold war however in the post 9/11 world it is also part of continental Air security, and S&R additionally despite What you might think any Russian attack on the US would pass over the pole and through Canadian Air space with attacks on Canadian targets either Directly or indirectly via fallout.
Despite what You might think Vincent. The US and Canada are linked at the hip. any attack on one will fall on to the other.

I am not advocating not buying fighters. We should use our limited defense dollars on cheap fighters that have greater range to patrol our expansive skies, something like the super hornet, not short legged f35. We should also get some force multipliers like AWACs. Russians don't really have stealth fighters anyways
 

FORBIN

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
LOL :)

Normaly on the way

Air Force Sees Potential Combat Missions This Year for F-35

Training, other deployments being considered after service declares up to 24 jets have initial combat capability, Col. David Chace, head of Air Force F-35 system management office, tells reporters.
  • “Where and when the airplane goes” depends on needs of combatant commanders: Chace
  • There are no known technical issues that would prevent declaration of initial operational capability in window starting Aug. 1 and going through Dec.: Chace
  • “We are in the last stages” of verifying combat capabilities, logistics and maintenance training: Chace
  • Air Force F-35s initially will carry either two 2,000-pound GPS-guided bombs or two 500-pound laser guided weapons, plus two air-to-air missiles
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F-35.jpg
 

Brumby

Major
F-35 Engine Upgrade Gathers Pace
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As Pratt & Whitney nears completion of the extensive F135 system development and demonstration (SDD) program for the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter engine, the company is revealing new details of a proposed upgrade that could cut fuel burn by as much as 7% on aircraft entering service by the early 2020s.

The upgrade package builds on a fuel-burn reduction technology effort driven by the U.S. Navy and an improved compressor developed by Pratt. Initial test results have been positive and are “building a lot of confidence” that the combination could be introduced as a relatively straightforward “drop-in” upgrade package, says Jimmy Kenyon, senior director of advanced programs and technology at Pratt & Whitney.

However, Pratt stresses that the potential upgrade, which would offer extended range and engine life to all F-35 variants, will have to be sold to the program before it becomes a reality. This not part of the JSF program, Kenyon says. “It is a Navy technology demonstration, but right now we are talking to the Joint Program Office, the services and the partners [about how to transition the technology] into some sort of modernization program that would follow-on from SDD. There’s a long way to go,” he cautions.

The fuel-burn reduction program, initially demonstrated on the modified F135 test engine XTE68/LF beginning in 2013, “has made a lot of progress,” says Kenyon. “The Navy is trying to demonstrate on the test stand a 5% improvement in fuel burn, and when we transition it to the final product there are some other things [with the compressor and turbine] we can do to integrate it into the aircraft that will yield 5-7% projected fuel-burn improvement,” he adds. Working with the Navy, Pratt is taking the turbine-cooling technology tested on XTE68/LF “and maturing that design. Instead of pushing the temperature, we are buying margin, allowing us to improve the efficiency of that part of the cycle.”

The improved design is focused on changes to the aerodynamics of the six integrated bladed rotors that form the high-pressure compressor module; it “takes advantage of the advances in aero design capability that have happened since the start of the F135 program,” Kenyon says. The revised configuration was rig tested at AneCom AeroTest’s facility in Wildau, Germany, in 2015. “We got the performance we expected and which we need out of that compressor to enable the overall engine improvement. So that becomes a big risk reduction for the program and that compressor design now is going into the engine demonstrator,” says Kenyon. The integrated test is expected to take place early in 2017.

The Navy, meanwhile, has “put hard constraints” on the extent of the changes to simplify eventual integration of the upgrades into the existing engine, says Kenyon. “We can’t mess with the diameter because it has to be retrofit-able and variant-common. So whether it is increasing thrust, or fuel-burn reduction, or if the Marine Corps needs additional powered lift [for the F135-600-powered F-35B short-takeoff-and-vertical-landing variant] this gives you that capability.” Maintaining commonality with the existing footprint of today’s turbine and compressor sections minimizes cost and reduces disruption. “This is a big deal,” says Kenyon. “It allows you to do this at the first depot interval.”

The concept is designed for “downward compatibility,” says F135 Vice President Mark Buongiorno. “By the time it cuts into production, if there are 1,000 aircraft, then you get the opportunity to bring [all of them] up to that current standard. That’s a significant number, and it is therefore important to keep the support of the international partners, some of which will have the majority of their aircraft delivered by then. That’s how the program will really continue to progress.”

Although initial runs of the combined engine upgrade package will begin as a technology demonstrator next year, Pratt is realistic about the time line for potential introduction. “You still have to qualify it on the airplane,” says Kenyon. “The sooner you start it, the sooner it becomes available. As you look at opportunities to get that started, you are probably looking at early to mid-2020s.”

In the nearer term, Pratt is positioning to improve the performance of the first stage of the F135 three-stage fan via a production change. The company is switching to a new linear friction-weld manufacturing process that will see the current hollow design replaced with a solid blade. “It’s a more efficient design and thinner,” says Buongiorno. The machine, which is one of the largest of its type in the world, is undergoing commissioning in Pratt’s Compressor System Module Center in Middletown, Connecticut, and more than doubles Pratt’s capacity to do friction welding. The change will be available in 2017.
 
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