European Economics Thread

[tphuang]

i will just say this on the EU chemical production drop. It must partially be blamed on China's dramatic rise in petrochemical production & independence. Thankfully, everyone is busy blaming the greens and higher energy prices, so you see very little blame placed on China (unlike say EVs)

 

[luminary]

The Italians are begging for an audience with Chinese ministers after their economy goes straight down the drain. Why parlay with a dog that bites the hand that feeds it?

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It has been reported that the Italian government has invited Chinese carmakers BYD and Chery to build plants in Italy.

Ambrosetti said Hong Kong had an important role in the bilateral partnership and that the city was “a very significant gateway to China” with unique expertise and know-how.
Hong Kong had also entered another phase of development by being part of the Greater Bay Area, which Ambrosetti said was “one of the most dynamic economic areas in the world”.

All flattery no subsidies or action.

 

[tphuang]

The Italians are begging for an audience with Chinese ministers after their economy goes straight down the drain. Why parlay with a dog that bites the hand that feeds it?

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All flattery no subsidies or action.

it does seem like the Italian gov't has gotten more cooperative recently. We will see what happens here. Italy has a horrible demographic issue and facing real migrant crisis and huge debt.

Getting enough Chinese EV/battery factories in Europe probably will head off market access issues

 

[sunnymaxi]

The Eurozone economy continues to struggle badly. Today, the final manufacturing PMI number came at 46.1 for March, below the growth/contraction line of 50, and lower than February's 46.5..

 

[gelgoog]

It's the de-industrialization of Europe basically. Losing Russian piped natural gas and moving towards LNG means they will pay at least 2x the price for energy. Which means heavy industry is in a pickle.

Even if renewables become competitive in electric generation you still need thermal power and high temperature process heat for a lot of heavy industry processes. Or cheap hydrocarbons. Which renewable electricity won't provide.

Europe doing several self-owns like closing perfectly functional nuclear power plants with still a lot of operational life left, and possibly banning or putting tariffs on Chinese renewable energy products like solar panels, lithium-ion batteries, only means they are digging themselves deeper into the hole.

 

[Topazchen]

It's the de-industrialization of Europe basically. Losing Russian piped natural gas and moving towards LNG means they will pay at least 2x the price for energy. Which means heavy industry is in a pickle.

Even if renewables become competitive in electric generation you still need thermal power and high temperature process heat for a lot of heavy industry processes. Or cheap hydrocarbons. Which renewable electricity won't provide.

Europe doing several self-owns like closing perfectly functional nuclear power plants with still a lot of operational life left, and possibly banning or putting tariffs on Chinese renewable energy products like solar panels, lithium-ion batteries, only means they are digging themselves deeper into the hole.

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[Overbom]

Things going well in Euroland. 6 months straight of sub-50 manufacturing PMI. Long may it continue

 

[tphuang]

Things going well in Euroland. 6 months straight of sub-50 manufacturing PMI. Long may it continue
View attachment 127559

Again, China is getting quite lucky that all of the usual right wing pundits are blaming this on Euro's embrace of Russian sanctions and green policies like shutting down the nuclear plants. Under normal circumstances, there would be a lot more blame going around on China's massive chemical refinery expansion or building refineries in Africa in places like Nigeria.

 

[siegecrossbow]

Mask off moment.

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[sndef888]

Just a curious thought exercise:

We all know Switzerland destroyed their reputation as a neutral banking destination after they sanctioned Russia

What are the consequences so far, if any?

And for a rich person in danger of being targeted by the West, what other alternatives do they have to protect their wealth?