Chinese UCAV/CCA/flying wing drones (ISR, A2A, A2G) thread

[huitong]

Obviously an aerial photo taken at the Shahe (沙河) airbase. They are the same image.

 

[ACuriousPLAFan]

Obviously an aerial photo taken at the Shahe (沙河) airbase. They are the same image.

Which part of the airbase, exactly if possible?

 

[Deino]

.…

@Deino do you mind asking him where he did he get that photo?

I did already but he usually does not reply, but from what I heard it is allegedly from an AI-generated video-clip which also included another fake one (in front of the one I asked for)!

There I updated this chart ...

 

[Temstar]

Shilao and Yankee talked again about the UADFs tonight among other things, although they used kind of vague terms. They implied:

1. CAC and SAC were rather surprised that the two UADFs were called to participate in the parade, in their opinion it's a lot earlier than expected

2. the UADFs actually have quite a lot of focus on dogfighting, as sort of insurance and bodyguard for J-20S and 6th gens which are highly focused on BVR. Yankee mentioned offhandedly "20G" but I'm not sure if that's just a figure of speech showing AI's advantage to human or if its meant to be taken literately

3. In experiments with manned fighter pairings it's found that UADFs are particularly fast at reaching for the kill shot compared to human pilots. To the point that human pilots afterwards complain of the AI doing "kill steal" on them. Pilots being highly prideful folks sometimes had to be comforted with words like "yeah but he's a computer, he's never going to get a promotion over you no matter how many kills he score" and "it's not about who gets the kill, it's about winning together as people's air force". Yankee joked that maybe for morale sake they need to figure out a way for AI to toast humans at the dinner afterwards to smooth things over.

4. The very best human pilots can still outfight an UADF, but it's physically and mentally exhausting and if immediately faced with another UADF they're very unlikely to win again.

5. Yankee described the UADFs as "not a gram of it was for a strike role, every bit of it is for air superiority". Instead of smaller CCAs (MQ-28, YFQ-42 and YFQ-44 mentioned here as examples) they said given their size and the power of their engine it's more useful to think of them as unmanned J-10.

6. Shilao described a scenario for their use. Imagine a J-20S (might have been J-36, I forgot) and a F-22 snuck on on each other with their stealth. They get into WVR combat and J-20S takes out a pair of PL-10 while F-22 starts spinning it's gun. Shilao describes using 5th gen this way ("knife fight in a phone booth" as he puts it) as "不体面" or "unbecoming" for high tech fighters. Instead if J-20S had a UADF bodyguard it could just tell it to dogfight and beat the F-22 while it gets away.

7. The very smooth and highly polished appearance was a requirement from higher up. In CAC and SAC's opinion these aircrafts have not yet reached a stage where such care and attention to detail are required. But the order from above was slick and aesthetic appearance was also a requirement for displaying such advanced aircrafts so they insisted on it much to CAC and SAC's annoyance. The new paint job for J-20A and J-20S was for similar reasons and to differentiate them from regular J-20. The powers that be understand the soft power advantages that came with showing off cool looking aircrafts.

Here's a part of that video:

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Including Shilao going on about that that scenario between J-20S+UADF vs F-22 as well as Yankee talking about PLAAF pilots getting upset at AI stealing their kill

 

[TK3600]

Isnt type F just B under wrap???

 

[kwaigonegin]

I was basing my speculation on the fact that f.e. there are UCAV versions mulled for T-75 and various NGAD/FA-XX projects and probably others as well (B-21 unmanned variant contemplated iirc?). A T-75 UCAV would be more or less in the same weight/power class as the chinese UADFs. So while the above projects seems to stem from manned aircraft, it is not unreasonable to assume that the possibility of manned versions of the CAC/SAC would not have been considered, as i said imo the driver for that would be primarily exports or perhaps VTOL (for which there are signs suggesting VTOL fighters are seriously contemplate).

Previously it was argued that for such a manned single engine 6th gen a clean sheet project would be needed, but given the multitude of very advanced airframes being worked on in China right now, at least two 6th gen and 2 or 3 UADFs, yet another clean sheet design might probably not the most indicated use of design resources, perhaps it's better to make maximum use of existing airframe elements (not unlike T-75 came to be).

To be clear, i don't know if manned versions of the UADF were contemplated and/or whether a single engine export 6th gen fighter is being considered (not unlike the JF-17 project in scope f.e.), but this is a possibility we shouldn't discount and should keep an eye out for.

Again false equivalency. It's 100X easier to turn a manned aircraft into a drone than it is the other way around.
I can go into the minutiae of it but seriously it's easier if you just research it yourself. Anyway this is getting off topic.

 

[xsub1223342]

Isnt type F just B under wrap???

Im not sure why people are still pushing for this other drone not being just a Type B when its a tarp covering it, a tarp will blow in the wind as it drives down the road or can be adjusted and slight change shape but its clearly the same drone under that tarp.

 

[Tomboy]

Im not sure why people are still pushing for this other drone not being just a Type B when its a tarp covering it, a tarp will blow in the wind as it drives down the road or can be adjusted and slight change shape but its clearly the same drone under that tarp.

This just makes no sense, the tarp for type B is flush with it. We've literally seen it with the tarp and it obviously look very different, no way a simple wind will blow it up to be so perfectly different in shape.

 

[Nautilus]

Have we seen both A and B under wraps?

 

[GTI]

I did already but he usually does not reply, but from what I heard it is allegedly from an AI-generated video-clip which also included another fake one (in front of the one I asked for)!

There I updated this chart ...

View attachment 160623

Do we have any collages that only compare Type F against Type B?

What if air / wind was getting underneath the tarp / cover as the truck was driving, causing it to inflate, lift up or bubble in some areas?