Chinese shipbuilding industry

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taxiya

Brigadier
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What I find "strange" is that the Chinese source of the report used "汽" instead of "气". Here from the link
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国内首台最大容量船用汽轮发电机组告捷：拥有完全知识产权
是支撑全电推进技术发展的重要成套设备
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Gas Turbine is 燃气轮机, while Steam Turbine is 蒸汽轮机. Although from the look of the picture and the texts (IEPS application), the primary mover should be a Gas Turbine, but the rest of the article all used "汽". That is very strange mistake unless the author is bad in written Chinese technical terms.
 
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taxiya

Brigadier
Registered Member
Iron Man said:
Ah, my mistake. This thing is a steam turbine, not a gas turbine.
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But isn't it strange to have steam turbine for IEPS which was the application of this project? Of course it will be natural if this IEPS is on a steam powered ship. That would mean that it is for the CVs.
 
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taxiya

Brigadier
Registered Member
I think it is steam after taking a look at the photo again. The red banner has "QZ" on it, Z must stand for "Zhengqi"/Steam.
 
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Iron Man

Major
Registered Member
taxiya said:
What I find "strange" is that the Chinese source of the report used "汽" instead of "气". Here from the link
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Gas Turbine is 燃气轮机, while Steam Turbine is 蒸汽轮机. Although from the look of the picture and the texts (IEPS application), the primary mover should be a Gas Turbine, but the rest of the article all used "汽". That is very strange mistake unless the author is bad in written Chinese technical terms.
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Well when it comes to IEP there doesn't really need to be a "prime mover" anymore since anything that generates power can power the electric motors, which should actually be thought of as the prime movers in the case of IEP.

taxiya said:
But isn't it strange to have steam turbine for IEPS which was the application of this project? Of course it will be natural if this IEPS is on a steam powered ship. That would mean that it is for the CVs.
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It may not be that strange. A "steam powered ship" is just a ship that uses steam turbines, like the Sovremenny and the 051B. If a particular steam turbine happens to be more energy efficient than a particular GT for then that one may be used instead of the GT. I'm pretty sure GTs in general do have a significant space advantage over steam turbines however, as GTs don't need separate boilers to generate the steam. Incidentally, I could easily see CV-18 being powered by GTs instead of steam turbines. I think the PLAN will pick based on size and efficiency of the turbines they have available to them. The winner is not necessarily a foregone conclusion.
 
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taxiya

Brigadier
Registered Member
Iron Man said:
Well when it comes to IEP there doesn't really need to be a "prime mover" anymore since anything that generates power can power the electric motors, which should actually be thought of as the prime movers in the case of IEP.
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Ignore what I said, it turned out to be steam.
It may not be that strange. A "steam powered ship" is just a ship that uses steam turbines, like the Sovremenny and the 051B. If a particular steam turbine happens to be more energy efficient than a particular GT for then that one may be used instead of the GT. I'm pretty sure GTs in general do have a significant space advantage over steam turbines however, as GTs don't need separate boilers to generate the steam. Incidentally, I could easily see CV-18 being powered by GTs instead of steam turbines. I think the PLAN will pick based on size and efficiency of the turbines they have available to them. The winner is not necessarily a foregone conclusion.
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Yes, both steam and GT works for IEP, and CV-18 can use either one of them. But a future nuclear CV will have to be steam, so this project is not an alternative but a must.
 
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schenkus

Junior Member
Registered Member
Hendrik_2000 said:
Via GS Zhou
China continues to dominate the world shipbuilding industry via capturing 40% of world new contracts 2017. The world total new contracts 2017 stand at 23.3 million CGT, and the portion won by Chinese shipbuilders are 9.2 million CGT.

South Korea, with 6.4 million CGT new orders, keeps the No.2 ranking; Japan, 2.0 million CGT, ranks at No.3.

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2018-01-19_upload_3006757_SIW-1306.jpg
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Chinese contracts almost doubled from 4.9 to 9.2 m CGT, could this big change in civilian business influence the rate of military shipbuilding ?

I could imagine some ways this could happen:
- busy shipyards won't bid for new military contracts (or only at high prices) and the navy might not be able to contract for all the ships they want (at least not at the budgeted price)
- shipyards might try to finish military projects extra fast, so that they have space to build the new civilian contracts
- the government might have increased military shipbuilding while shipyards had few civilian contracts to keep them busy and might now slow down military orders as the shipyards don't need them anymore to survive
 
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Terry Cotter

New Member
Registered Member
taxiya said:
But isn't it strange to have steam turbine for IEPS which was the application of this project? Of course it will be natural if this IEPS is on a steam powered ship. That would mean that it is for the CVs.
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I think you are forgetting nuclear submarines. After all, it was in the context of propulsion for the Type 095/096 that the IEPS advances were being reported a couple of months ago.
 
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AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
schenkus said:
Chinese contracts almost doubled from 4.9 to 9.2 m CGT, could this big change in civilian business influence the rate of military shipbuilding ?

I could imagine some ways this could happen:
- busy shipyards won't bid for new military contracts (or only at high prices) and the navy might not be able to contract for all the ships they want (at least not at the budgeted price)
- shipyards might try to finish military projects extra fast, so that they have space to build the new civilian contracts
- the government might have increased military shipbuilding while shipyards had few civilian contracts to keep them busy and might now slow down military orders as the shipyards don't need them anymore to survive
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Commercial shipbuilding capacity in China grew even greater than production.

And the shipbuilding industry in China is now consolidating because there are too many shipyards
 
Quickie

Quickie

Colonel
taxiya said:
What I find "strange" is that the Chinese source of the report used "汽" instead of "气". Here from the link
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Gas Turbine is 燃气轮机, while Steam Turbine is 蒸汽轮机. Although from the look of the picture and the texts (IEPS application), the primary mover should be a Gas Turbine, but the rest of the article all used "汽". That is very strange mistake unless the author is bad in written Chinese technical terms.
Click to expand...

Iron Man said:
Well when it comes to IEP there doesn't really need to be a "prime mover" anymore since anything that generates power can power the electric motors, which should actually be thought of as the prime movers in the case of IEP.


It may not be that strange. A "steam powered ship" is just a ship that uses steam turbines, like the Sovremenny and the 051B. If a particular steam turbine happens to be more energy efficient than a particular GT for then that one may be used instead of the GT. I'm pretty sure GTs in general do have a significant space advantage over steam turbines however, as GTs don't need separate boilers to generate the steam. Incidentally, I could easily see CV-18 being powered by GTs instead of steam turbines. I think the PLAN will pick based on size and efficiency of the turbines they have available to them. The winner is not necessarily a foregone conclusion.
Click to expand...

It's quite possible for both the Gas Turbine and Steam Turbine to be used as the components for a combined cycle powerplant, COGAS. It's a new concept in terms of marine powerplant and an aircraft carrier certainly has enough space for it.

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