in the end, it's all about getting the best deal from China. Thailand would gladly buy the submarines if it can keep getting free stuff from China
Chinese Naval Export: News, Views, Pics & Videos
- Thread starter philbob
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CHD620V16H6 is Chinese version of the German MTU16V396SE84 diesel generator (generating electricity for the sub)
It's been adopted for submarine usage with extra dampening
Chinese Marine Propulsion
Did Germany block the MTU396 ? I would be very surprised if it is the case
www.sinodefenceforum.com
Why did China decide to export the German engines in the first place? China needs to replace the German and French engines in its ships and submarines with domestic engines as soon as possible
FriedRiceNSpice
Captain
I believe it was requested by the customer. All current generation Chinese submarines and other naval vessels should be using fully domestic engines. Chinese Yuans use AIP so they don't even use engines of the same type.
The Stirling engine is a separate system from the diesel engines. I dont know what the Type 039A/B/C use exactly but they certainly also use diesel engines and I think its more than likely they use locally produced MTU-type diesels.
The issue with the MTU engines, as far as I am aware, is that China may still build them locally for domestic use but they do not have an agreement in place with Germany to put them on export boats and hence require approval from Berlin.
The issue with the MTU engines, as far as I am aware, is that China may still build them locally for domestic use but they do not have an agreement in place with Germany to put them on export boats and hence require approval from Berlin.
The terminology used in that article is indeed confusing. In the typical contemporary diesel-electric submarine:
1. There are two or more diesel engines.
2. Each diesel engine drives an electricity generator. (An engine-generator combination is often referred to simply as a "generator," e.g., "The hospital has diesel generators for backup power.")
2. The generators charge the batteries.
3. The batteries power an electric motor, which turns the screw, i.e., propeller.
There is no mechanical linkage between the diesel engines and the screw, so in that sense the diesel engines are not propulsion engines, not in the way a conventional ICE automobile is propelled by its engine.
So the following excerpt from the linked Bangkok Post article is misleading, whether because of inaccurate translation or otherwise:
"The two sides agreed the submarine would be installed with a CHD620 electric generator as a replacement for the German MTU396 engine.
"'The CHD620 is, in fact, a submarine electric generator. It is not meant to serve as an engine,' according to the source."
The CHD620 and the MTU396 are both diesel engines, and in the S26T submarine they do exactly the same thing: They drive an electricity generator that charges the batteries that powers the electric motor that turns the screw. The implication or suggestion that the MTU396 serves as a propulsion engine while the CHD620 does not, or that they work differently from each other, is simply incorrect.
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No, CHD620 is almost certainly derived from MWM TBD620 and has nothing to do with MTU designs.
Chinese Marine Propulsion
Hydrogen is a kind of shitty choice for fuel though. And that is what you will be using to power PEM Fuel Cells.
www.sinodefenceforum.com
Norinco has license to manufacture MTU396 for Chinese domestic market, and Chinese SSKs are powered by these. I'm sure CSSC wants to switch to CHD620 because then they would get to make the engine instead of Norinco, but the navy probably thinks it's unnecessary to fix something that ain't broken.
Not sure if anyone had said that CHD620's design is derived from MTU396?
Thanks for the good info / links though.
The generator can also power the electric motor direct if sub runs on surface, for instance, between bases.
A simple graphic to illustrate the concept. Basically all diesel electric submarines nowadays wont have any direct mechanical connection between the diesel engines and the shaft/propulsor (WW2 era designs would have a direct drive between diesel and screw plus an electric motor for dived sailing fed by batteries which were charged by the diesel engines). The last Chinese types using the old arrangement were (are) the Type 035. Since the Type 039 (SONG) the arrangement is as below.
