The rumored “PL-20” MRAAM that is meant to fit 6 in the J-20’s bay is supposed to have the same range as the PL-15. The same source said at a different (much earlier) point in time that there is already a modified version of the PL-12 that fits 6 in the J-20’s weapon’s bay, but the PL-15 superseded that version.
Chinese air to ground weapons (missiles, PGMs, etc)
- Thread starter AssassinsMace
- Start date
If this PL-20 as the same effective range as PL-15 there would be little reason to have PL-15 unless it just has a much better seeker owing to larger diameter radome. I doubt a few cm of diameter (if that) can offer that much advantage as to justify an entirely different MRAAM frame. There must be some reduction in range for PL-20 if these missiles are designed and manufactured using similar levels of available technology. Modified PL-12s with folding fins can indeed fit 6 and the missile replacing current PL-12s would also be able to. I can't see PL-20 being too different to PL-12 in terms of dimensions and frame because they would want to maximise its range while still managing to fit 6 internally with J-20. So essentially a PL-12 with better effective range and seekers with foldable fins variants for J-20s and future stealth fighters/drones. But not quite the same range as PL-15.
PL-20 will be a missile that is developed with newer technology than PL-15.
It is very possible that they had certain performance requirements that they wanted to aim for and were willing to have four PL-15s in the weapons bay rather than have six smaller missiles but unable to achieve those hypothetical performance requirements.
But now quite a few years later, the relevant technology could've advanced somewhat such that they're able to achieve those performance requirements in a smaller missile.
The reason to have the PL-15 over a future supposed PL-20 is that the PL-15 is already in production and is operation ready while a rumoured PL-20 would still be/is still in development. The PL-15 is more technologically advanced than the PL-12. That’s why it superseded later variants of the PL-12. Does that’s mean there was no point developing the PL-12?
One can pretty much assume, as missile tech development is an ongoing process, that a supposed PL-20 currently in development would be more technologically advanced than the PL-15. After all, if the PL-15’s development started sometime around 2011, the gap in time between when the PL-15 emerged and when the PL-12 emerged would probably be pretty similar to the gap in time between when the PL-20 emerges and when the PL-15 emerged. Improvements needed to fit six PL-15 class missiles into the J-20 may not even be that drastic. It could be as simple as miniaturization, weight savings, or more efficient packing of components leading to a slightly smaller or thinner missile body, slight increase in efficiency of the motor allowing for slightly less propellant and thus the need for a smaller missile volume, or more advanced aerodynamics allowing for more compact fins.
There is no point in developing a missile with the range of a PL-12 that can fit 6 in the J-20’s weapon’s bay when they can already fit 6 PL-12’s into the J-20’s weapons bay, when the PL-15 isn’t significantly bigger than the PL-12, and when you already have equal or better technology than the PL-15. The major improvement between the PL-12 and PL-15 responsible for the range increase was not the size of the missile body but the rocket motor technology.
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The bigger problem is at what range would an E-2D detect a J-20 by counterstealth radar? My figures are between 200 and 400 km. The PL-15, if it can reach 300 km, has a very strong chance of being able to knock out an E-2D on sight; i.e, the moment the E-2D sees a J-20, the J-20 has been noting its passive emissions for quite some time and can fire an interceptor missile to knock out the E-2D.
With 4 PL-15s, you don't exactly have excellent range, but it means that you can fire quite a salvo of missiles to saturate the E-2D's point defenses. 2 PL-21s might have longer range, but 2 PL-21s are easier to knock out due to low numbers.
Then, you have AEW&C support in KJ-600s to detect F-35s, while the F-35s are now fighting without AEW&C support. With AEW&C support and with the opponent lacking AEW&C support, the J-20s now have a decisive advantage.
With 4 PL-15s, you don't exactly have excellent range, but it means that you can fire quite a salvo of missiles to saturate the E-2D's point defenses. 2 PL-21s might have longer range, but 2 PL-21s are easier to knock out due to low numbers.
Then, you have AEW&C support in KJ-600s to detect F-35s, while the F-35s are now fighting without AEW&C support. With AEW&C support and with the opponent lacking AEW&C support, the J-20s now have a decisive advantage.
Why use PL-15s mounted on the J-20 to knock down AWACs when you already have a PL-X missile that can do the same at safer range?
On the range question, the PL-20 will be at least a generation ahead of PL-12 with the same dimensions, making it a more lethal missile with slightly greater range. The consideration for service availability and production costs is going to mean PL-12s and PL-15s (older variants of them) will be around for a while and latest versions still manufactured but it doesn't mean PL-20 will have same effectiveness as PL-12. All I'm saying is PL-20 should have similar dimensions to PL-12 because they want to maximise its range while still fitting 6 in J-20 which the PL-12 is able to achieve with foldable fins. PL-15 may receive upgrades to software, seekers, and motor or fuel in future but the shell will be kept. PL-15 offer even greater range than PL-12 and upgrades to PL-15 using the latest technology available will mean it should have better effective range than older versions of PL-15. In this regard, PL-20 may not only end up with the same dimensions as PL-12 but also look almost identical outside of the foldable fins.
Hyperwarp
Captain
PL-X is a J-16 weapon. It is a small air-launched ballistic missile with a far greater ranger than the PL-15 or even a hypothetical PL-21. J-16 can fire it from a safe range at enemy AEW&C, Other EW aircrafts and tankers.
PL-15 with 300km range?? Do you mean PL-21 or the PL-xx that's been seen on J-16 in the past? That one doesn't fit the J-20. Also do you mean active emissions of the E-2D? These assets are usually very well supported and suppose they can find J-20 at 300km range, they will vector stealth and non-stealth fighters to intercept the J-20. To combat this, PLAAF needs huge numbers of J-20s supported by J-16s and others all directed by AEWC to counter the exact same moves by F-35s and F-22s. Defeating well defended AEWC is no easy task for stealth fighters. Precisely why J-20 desperately needs to be able to hold 6 MRAAMs and even better if they can fit longer range missiles similar to PL-xx and PL-21 internally one day.