China's transport, tanker & heavy lift aircraft

gala8

Just Hatched
Registered Member
Unlike fighter jets with "buried" internal engines, these cargo planes have under-wing engines. Do you guys think WS20 upgrades will be relatively plug and play or brand new chassis would be needed for the upgrades?
A software update of the flight control system should suffice.
 

tupolevtu144

Junior Member
Registered Member
A software update of the flight control system should suffice.
It's not that simple because unless they have already factored in the increased thrust, increased drag, increased lift and the shift in center of gravity the new engines will cause when they were designing the plane in first place, i think there will be problems on the hardware side as well.
 

Xizor

Captain
Registered Member
Someone once asked about whether WS-20 equipped on Y-20 had Thrust Reversal. We don't have any videos of the sole Y-20 landing with these new engines, have we?


02F41398-AD07-4B1F-AFD9-DC89CD5D3B02.jpeg
 
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GTI

Junior Member
Registered Member
Someone once asked about whether WS-20 equipped on Y-20 had Thrust Reversal. We don't have any videos of the sole Y-20 landing with these new engines, have we?


View attachment 74441
Surely you mean what type of thrust reversers will it have?

D-30KP-2s on current Y-20s have thrust reversers, you wouldn’t really build a large [heavy] transport or commercial aircraft without them…

Now, as to whether the WS-20 equipped Y-20 will have (C-17) features like reverse taxiing or engaging reverse thrusters while still landing etc., I believe is up for discussion/speculation.
 

Xizor

Captain
Registered Member
Surely you mean what type of thrust reversers will it have?

D-30KP-2s on current Y-20s have thrust reversers, you wouldn’t really build a large [heavy] transport or commercial aircraft without them…

Now, as to whether the WS-20 equipped Y-20 will have (C-17) features like reverse taxiing or engaging reverse thrusters while still landing etc., I believe is up for discussion/speculation.
That the D-30KP equipped Y-20 having Thrust reverser is common knowledge. But WS-20 on Y-20 having them is not clear.

Since WS-20 is a new engine and since we have only one example Y-20 equipping them, it won't be a surprise to have Thrust Reversal be not included. C-17 is not at all a party to this issue.
 

crash8pilot

Junior Member
Registered Member
That the D-30KP equipped Y-20 having Thrust reverser is common knowledge. But WS-20 on Y-20 having them is not clear.

Since WS-20 is a new engine and since we have only one example Y-20 equipping them, it won't be a surprise to have Thrust Reversal be not included. C-17 is not at all a party to this issue.
Considering shortfield landings are a crucial military airlift capability and mission set (and you'll need all sorts of decelerating tools from reinforced braking pads, spoilers, thrust reversers... just to cut down on landing distance on short/soft fields), I expect WS-20 engined Y-20s to absolutely have thrust reversers.... Heck even the turboprop Dash-8 I used to fly had two stages of beta reversers on them.
 

Xizor

Captain
Registered Member
Considering shortfield landings are a crucial military airlift capability and mission set (and you'll need all sorts of decelerating tools from reinforced braking pads, spoilers, thrust reversers... just to cut down on landing distance on short/soft fields), I expect WS-20 engined Y-20s to absolutely have thrust reversers.... Heck even the turboprop Dash-8 I used to fly had two stages of beta reversers on them.
Indeed. My question wasn't IF at at it'll be included but rather If it is included in the first example Y20.
The answer to that, it seems, still is " Very likely, but we have got no clear visual confirmation". That's Ok.
 

crash8pilot

Junior Member
Registered Member
Indeed. My question wasn't IF at at it'll be included but rather If it is included in the first example Y20.
The answer to that, it seems, still is " Very likely, but we have got no clear visual confirmation". That's Ok.
Well then in that case based on the difference in colors (grey and yellow) that are painted, my hypothesis is that WS-20 engined Y-20s utilize translating cold stream type reversers (as compared to the clampshell type reversers featured on the Y-20 that use D-30KP engines, or pivoting door reversers) where the grey colored bits on each side of the engine acts as a reverser door that actuates and translates backwards when thrust reversers are selected on the landing rollout.

HotWellinformedAfricanaugurbuzzard-max-1mb.gif

Gif of an engine that uses translating cold stream reversers. Now picture the moving bit (reverser door) in this gif being the grey colored bit.
68066-cf806265cb2ed0f23f4b67b328944511.jpg
 

Xizor

Captain
Registered Member
Well then in that case based on the difference in colors (grey and yellow) that are painted, my hypothesis is that WS-20 engined Y-20s utilize translating cold stream type reversers (as compared to the clampshell type reversers featured on the Y-20 that use D-30KP engines, or pivoting door reversers) where the grey colored bits on each side of the engine acts as a reverser door that actuates and translates backwards when thrust reversers are selected on the landing rollout.

HotWellinformedAfricanaugurbuzzard-max-1mb.gif

Gif of an engine that uses translating cold stream reversers. Now picture the moving bit (reverser door) in this gif being the grey colored bit.
68066-cf806265cb2ed0f23f4b67b328944511.jpg
Yes. I just wanted someone to point the dual colorings ( although I must say that I went with the clam type TR similar to D-30KP).

In any way, there is only just a possibility and "we have no confirmation" is the right answer for the time being.
 

crash8pilot

Junior Member
Registered Member
Yes. I just wanted someone to point the dual colorings ( although I must say that I went with the clam type TR similar to D-30KP).

In any way, there is only just a possibility and "we have no confirmation" is the right answer for the time being.
Clamshell type reversers typically are featured on engines that are narrower. The WS-20s seem to have a bit more girth to use clamshells.

Just saying from my perspective as a pilot, I can't imagine a plane (regardless of whether its a prototype or not) that doesn't have any sort of reversers. Even if I'm planning on using idle reverse on the longest runway and a headwind that'll guarantee minimal landing distance, my fingers are literally on the reverse levers as soon as the mains touch the tarmac. Both types I've flown (Dash-8 and the A320) have two audible calls to make sure reversers are selected/working as part of our standard operating procedures.
 
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