China's transport, tanker & heavy lift aircraft
- Thread starter Totoro
- Start date
THE name of game is always system integration.
ARJ21 is a disaster if one don't mince the words. they started out same time frame as the E170/190 and approximately occupies the same slot in the market.
E-Jets was certified way 2002-3 time frame and has a close to 1000 entering the service as of today... that is one thousand. with couple of hundred more on order.
ARJ21 has yet to be certified. even by the Chinese CAAC. (!). and there is talk of ditching the program altogether (which would not be a bad idea imho)
both use approximately the same main suppliers. Honeywell/Parker/GE/Rockwell on its sub systems.
That shows how far lagged behind chinese are in term of system integration.
now... un stable corporate structure (it was designed by Xian before it was "handed off" to 660 and then COMAC) has hindered it greatly but still it shows how unprepared the chinese are in commercial aviation .
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
Thomas Edison once said when asked why he kept going even when failure was all he had to show for himself. " Well I know a thousand ways not to build a light bulb."
ARJ may not be off the ground but 919 has not even left the computer. Once that happens life has a way of showing problems no one thought of. So before we laud any thing as the best thing since sliced bread (wow I am digging out a corny saying.) lets wait till it actually leaves the factory. We can look at it project for it and debate possibilitys but lets be rational until roll out its not a sold deal until follow on its not a revolution and until production its only possibilities. ARJ is a step to 919and even if its killed its as Edison said just another way not to build a light bulb. But the lessons learned are. What worked and what did not will be factors worked for every new jet that the Chinese build from now on.
ARJ may not be off the ground but 919 has not even left the computer. Once that happens life has a way of showing problems no one thought of. So before we laud any thing as the best thing since sliced bread (wow I am digging out a corny saying.) lets wait till it actually leaves the factory. We can look at it project for it and debate possibilitys but lets be rational until roll out its not a sold deal until follow on its not a revolution and until production its only possibilities. ARJ is a step to 919and even if its killed its as Edison said just another way not to build a light bulb. But the lessons learned are. What worked and what did not will be factors worked for every new jet that the Chinese build from now on.
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
I think you missed the point, Embarer is over 40 years old, how old is AVIC or COMAC, you can't expect same from both organisations
The biggest mistake China can do is to cancel, they will have wasted all that work, and in today's day and age you can't do that
China must push ahead, take 5 more years but don't scrap the project, the orders are from company's that have governmental backing and won't be cancelled so easily
Even if ARJ21 goes into production in 2015 that is good odds for any company's first attempt, C919 will be easier, the lessons learned from ARJ21 will build future expertise
I'll point out that nothing's worse than bringing an obsolete product late to market in this globalized hyper competitive product cycle. When there's no consolation for good efforts and first attempts it's probably better to cut your losses than to sink them in deeper. In China's case, given the intention of the ARJ21 was not to make a profit but to acquire the necessary organizational and knowledge capital to run a domestic industry, a cancellation would not be a waste. You don't learn much about sailing on a sinking ship. You learn other things about ships which may be valuable and useful though.
Prelim Design was pretty much started out same time.
even if you give Ejet a 5 year starting time.... ARJ has still yet finish some of its most critical certification flight tests and it is 2013. you do the math.
ARJ was suppose to be a quick and dirty job to jump start ACAC/later COMAC.
how hard can it be...get a MD90 fuselage barrel and a new wing design from antonov and voila you have a airplane.
little do they know... ever since the late 1960s (Y-10 Days) the commercial airliner oem business has gotten alot more complicated.