Canadian News Thread

[PiSigma]

I don't want to dismiss Albertan concerns, but federal politics are about the entire country. The Liberals already spent billions of federal tax dollars to buy the transmountain pipeline, and to me, that is already a huge investment in Alberta. Sure, it comes with a number of legal issues and you may not agree with how the Liberals are handling those issues, but you need to understand that the rest of country see climate change as an important issue. Even those of us who support the pipelines do not want to see the oil industry grow unchecked, which is basically what the Saskatchewan PM proposed with his recent letter to Trudeau calling for the cancellation of the Carbon Tax.

BTW, very few people in Ontario are happy about the fact that our governments keep propping up the auto industry. Billions of dollars are wasted propping up the jobs of a few thousand people, and anyone with a sense can see that automation will eliminate those jobs regardless. Unfortunately, Canadian politics being what they are, there are powerful special interest groups that every politician want to appeal to.

I grew up in Quebec, so I had to laugh, though not in any mean spirited way, when I read that you think threatening separation would get you special deals. Trust me when I say Quebec is a special basket case, and you don't want Alberta to end up like Quebec!

Quebec has some of the highest, if not the highest, provincial taxes in the country, and most of that money is wasted on BS like policing the language on store signs, and I guess now policing the headwear of teachers. The very reason they receive the lion's share of equalization payments is because they are the second most populous province AND their economy is shit. Growing up, unless you were an ardent sovereigntist, everyone was well aware that the Quebec economy is dragged down by the constant talk of separation.

I don't believe the Liberals are out to kill Alberta's industry, but they're not going to give the oil industry a free reign either. IMO, Alberta could benefit from some diversification. Over-reliance on the oil industry means you guys get screwed every time the US depresses oil prices to punish Russia. Alberta oil is especially vulnerable, as I'm sure you are well aware, because it's expensive to extract and you can only sell it to the US.

More importantly, a Conservative government would not be able to do anything different from what the Liberals are doing currently. A Conservative government is not going to be able to force BC to agree, and regardless of how many people you think supports the pipeline in BC, the fact is that the province is unlikely to change that stance anytime soon. What the Conservatives WOULD BE doing, however, would be to work more closely with the Americans to further the American global agenda (the treaty used to arrest Meng was signed under Harper), promote anti-China rhetoric like during the Harper years, and participate in more military adventures that do not benefit Canada (Libya).

To me, those are more important considerations than Alberta's pipeline.

The liberals only bought TMX because they wouldn't defend it in the first place.

We tried this whole "social license" BS when NDP got elected in 2015 in Alberta, and it just screwed us further.

80% of GHG emissions comes out of burning oil, which means the car, and ship and plane. And Alberta's oil production is actually less GHG intensive than most places on the planet. So using climate change as an excuse to limit Canadian oil while importing Saudi oil (more GHG intensive due to extra shipping) is hypocritical.

The BC folks that are opposed to TMX for some reason want more ferries... That burns oil. And want to reduce 14 ships a week due to TMX to protect whales... And add an order of magnitude more ferries.. because whales only hit oil tankers.

 

[solarz]

The liberals only bought TMX because they wouldn't defend it in the first place.

We tried this whole "social license" BS when NDP got elected in 2015 in Alberta, and it just screwed us further.

80% of GHG emissions comes out of burning oil, which means the car, and ship and plane. And Alberta's oil production is actually less GHG intensive than most places on the planet. So using climate change as an excuse to limit Canadian oil while importing Saudi oil (more GHG intensive due to extra shipping) is hypocritical.

The BC folks that are opposed to TMX for some reason want more ferries... That burns oil. And want to reduce 14 ships a week due to TMX to protect whales... And add an order of magnitude more ferries.. because whales only hit oil tankers.

Why would the Liberals buy the pipeline if they don't want to build it? That makes no sense. They could have just nixed it and gotten a better result at the election.

Aren't we importing Saudi oil because we can't refine the crude ourselves? If we could use the oil ourselves, why bother with a pipeline to the coast?

 

[PiSigma]

Why would the Liberals buy the pipeline if they don't want to build it? That makes no sense. They could have just nixed it and gotten a better result at the election.

Aren't we importing Saudi oil because we can't refine the crude ourselves? If we could use the oil ourselves, why bother with a pipeline to the coast?

We are importing oil from Saudi because there is no west to east oil pipeline in Canada. Energy east was suppose to be able to send oil from Alberta and Saskatchewan to refineries in Sarnia, Montreal and new Brunswick. Even with energy east, we would be an energy exporter. Instead, refineries in Montreal and saint john needs to buy heavy Saudi crude because the only way to get Canadian oil there is to load it on a ship at Vancouver and go through the Panama canal. The refineries in Canada including saint john is capable of refining Canadian oil.

Heavy crude from Alberta often charges a premium in North American refineries for what they are worth because it allows u to make naphtha( gasoline), distillates (diesel and kerosene - jet fuel) and gas oils. Whereas the light oil from shale in Texas is only good for gasoline.

Liberals bought TMX with government money, not their personal money. It didn't need to be bought, only reason is the risk got too high due to the constant litigations and moving goal posts. The existing one operated for 65 years without problems.

Then there is Vancouver, they want our oil to lower their gas price, but don't want a pipeline to get the oil there.....

 

[solarz]

We are importing oil from Saudi because there is no west to east oil pipeline in Canada. Energy east was suppose to be able to send oil from Alberta and Saskatchewan to refineries in Sarnia, Montreal and new Brunswick. Even with energy east, we would be an energy exporter. Instead, refineries in Montreal and saint john needs to buy heavy Saudi crude because the only way to get Canadian oil there is to load it on a ship at Vancouver and go through the Panama canal. The refineries in Canada including saint john is capable of refining Canadian oil.

Heavy crude from Alberta often charges a premium in North American refineries for what they are worth because it allows u to make naphtha( gasoline), distillates (diesel and kerosene - jet fuel) and gas oils. Whereas the light oil from shale in Texas is only good for gasoline.

Liberals bought TMX with government money, not their personal money. It didn't need to be bought, only reason is the risk got too high due to the constant litigations and moving goal posts. The existing one operated for 65 years without problems.

Then there is Vancouver, they want our oil to lower their gas price, but don't want a pipeline to get the oil there.....

Good to know. I'm guessing there's no West to East pipeline because of Quebec opposition? Why can't we build more refineries in Alberta?

 

[PiSigma]

Good to know. I'm guessing there's no West to East pipeline because of Quebec opposition? Why can't we build more refineries in Alberta?

Yep Quebec rather buy oil from Saudi, Azerbaijan and other awesome places than Canada.

We are building another refinery in Alberta, but then still need to ship the refined products out to customers in Ontario and Quebec. So unless we build a pipe for each refined product....

It always makes more sense to build a crude pipeline and have it refined locally. Each area's refined product requirements are different. That's why there are a ton of refining capacity in Sarnia and Montreal.

 

[Just4Fun]

A breakdown of the election results:

View attachment 54779

One thing that jumped out at me is that the Consevatives would need to ally with both the Bloc Quebecois *and* the New Democrats in order to defeat the Liberals, and that's something that is just not likely to happen anytime soon.

Unfortunately, I'm not optimistic about Canada-China relations. If there was any issue that could unite the Cons with the Bloc and the NDP, it would probably be China, so Trudeau would need to tread doubly carefully on China issues.

Yet, at the same time, I see an opportunity for China. The Bloc Quebecois only cares about Quebec, so if China can offer Quebec some sweet deals, the Bloc may very well turn China-friendly, and this would give the Liberals the support they need to resolve the diplomatic impasse.[/QUOTE

Yet, at the same time, I see an opportunity for China. The Bloc Quebecois only cares about Quebec, so if China can offer Quebec some sweet deals, the Bloc may very well turn China-friendly, and this would give the Liberals the support they need to resolve the diplomatic impasse.

China will never get into other country's internal affairs. Exploring Canada's Quebec wounds for political gains is directly against Chinese philosophy, especially using it against a small and weak country, such as Canada.

As for China-Canada relation, the Liberals are not as bad as the Cons. Trudeau is definitely better than Harper. It is not Trudeau's fault in Canada's handling of Huawei issues. Trudeau can only work as a Washington puppet within the frame of Canadian political establishment and within the arrangement of the Five-eyes, or he will be fired, or even get killed, in no time if he does something against US interest in international affairs. The US is the largest customer of Canada. The economic tie between the two countries are rockily solid. No matter who is Canada's Prime Minister, Canada has to take order from Washington.

It is likely that Canada will have another election in about two years. Trudeau's minority government can't survive long.

 

[solarz]

China will never get into other country's internal affairs. Exploring Canada's Quebec wounds for political gains is directly against Chinese philosophy, especially using it against a small and weak country, such as Canada.

As for China-Canada relation, the Liberals are not as bad as the Cons. Trudeau is definitely better than Harper. It is not Trudeau's fault in Canada's handling of Huawei issues. Trudeau can only work as a Washington puppet within the frame of Canadian political establishment and within the arrangement of the Five-eyes, or he will be fired, or even get killed, in no time if he does something against US interest in international affairs. The US is the largest customer of Canada. The economic tie between the two countries are rockily solid. No matter who is Canada's Prime Minister, Canada has to take order from Washington.

It is likely that Canada will have another election in about two years. Trudeau's minority government can't survive long.

Offering business deals to Quebec is hardly interfering in Canada's internal affairs. Ontario has often sent trade delegations to China, and I believe Quebec probably does the same.

As for Trudeau, I was pretty pissed at the way he handled the Meng affair. The whole "judicial independence" excuse was revealed to be a farce when the SNC-Lavalin scandal broke. He could have saved Canada a lot of grief had he simply ordered Meng released, or better yet prevented her arrest in the first place. I sincerely believe that's what Pierre Trudeau, or even Jean Chrétien, would have done. Canada does not *have* to take orders from Washington, as Chrétien amply demonstrated when he refused to join the invasion of Iraq.

Obviously, Scheer and the Conservatives would have eagerly sent Meng to the US immediately.