Blackstone
Brigadier
The bottom line is some kind of accommodation needs to be discussed between Presidents Obama and Xi; the temperature is getting too hot and both sides should look at new models of major country relations.
Australian Military News, Reports, Data, etc.
- Thread starter Jeff Head
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Let's not get into direct war scenarios, okay? It's against SD rules in any case.
The fact is, overall security concerns should not be driven by a few islands in the SCS in any case.
The overall need for maritime security is much broader than that, and Australia has always stood with several nations to achieve those security needs, with all providing mutual support towards national interests.
The fact is, overall security concerns should not be driven by a few islands in the SCS in any case.
The overall need for maritime security is much broader than that, and Australia has always stood with several nations to achieve those security needs, with all providing mutual support towards national interests.
Blackstone
Brigadier
Actually, I've been following Hugh White for years, and his objective isn't debate on Australian weapon platforms, rather he wants US to share power with China to avoid great power conflicts. I highly recommend White's book, The China Choice, it's an excellent read.
Blackstone
Brigadier
Yes, but the calculus for Australia is much different now. In the past, Australia's main economic partners were Europe and the US, it's security was first guaranteed by Britain, and then by the US after WWII. Fast forward to today, we still have Australia under US security blanket, but it's biggest trading partner now, by far, is China. Does it mean it would choose one over the other? No one knows for sure, but we all saw how fast Prime Minister Abbott shot down B-1 basing in Australia the moment the topic went public. I guess what I'm trying to say is Australia's national interests are more difficult and less clear cut today than in the past, and it will do it's very best to walk a thin line between being an ally of the US and a "friend" with China.
As an Aussie myself, I'd like to see our government build a strong and friendly relationship with China, while also doing it's best to maintain good relations with Japan and the U.S.. I'd love to see us become a neutral party which acts as a mediator between Asia and the West, even between Asian countries. I'm not sure our political class has the vision or means to make this happen though. Making it happen would be a long and difficult road to take. Which is partly why I think we should do it... If we took a truly neutral stance, we could help resolve the disputes in the SCS, and the disputes between Japan and China, and Korea. And all of this is in our strategic interest.
I'm basically in agreement with our former PM Malcolm Fraser in his book "Dangerous Allies".
Putting aside the provocative and politically charged title, Malcolm was (he died not long ago) not explicitly anti-U.S., but he wanted Australia to become strategically independent, I guess a bit like Sweden. That would mean for starters that we'd need to spend more on our military, which I'm fine with. I've long disliked the idea of the ADF integrating into the U.S. military, while also lacking capabilities it needs to operate on its own in a defensive war. Building up those capabilities would cost, but it would also create jobs, which we sorely need.
Our pollies talk about ANZUS as if it is a mutual defense treaty when strictly speaking, it's only a commitment to consult. The Americans don't have to come to our aid if they choose not to, and we likewise have no strict obligation to aid them in a war we believe is against our national interest. We need to find our own voice.
I'm basically in agreement with our former PM Malcolm Fraser in his book "Dangerous Allies".
Putting aside the provocative and politically charged title, Malcolm was (he died not long ago) not explicitly anti-U.S., but he wanted Australia to become strategically independent, I guess a bit like Sweden. That would mean for starters that we'd need to spend more on our military, which I'm fine with. I've long disliked the idea of the ADF integrating into the U.S. military, while also lacking capabilities it needs to operate on its own in a defensive war. Building up those capabilities would cost, but it would also create jobs, which we sorely need.
Our pollies talk about ANZUS as if it is a mutual defense treaty when strictly speaking, it's only a commitment to consult. The Americans don't have to come to our aid if they choose not to, and we likewise have no strict obligation to aid them in a war we believe is against our national interest. We need to find our own voice.
SamuraiBlue
Captain
Reading the recent articles I have a bad feeling that Australia sees herself not directly involved and thus not their problem. Like Hugh White says Australia wants to be neutral and isolated. I guess Australia sees herself not part of Asia and independent belonging to the Southern hemisphere. To them I speculate the sovereign territorial issue of Antarctica is much more important.
broadsword
Brigadier
There is no way Australia will go the way Malcom Fraser wished. Australia will always stay in the Anglo-Saxon gang unless the US degenerates into a Soviet Union-esque condition, leaving Australia to fend for itself.
Not for the moment, no. But my generation (I'm in my 20's) is far more open to the idea of Australia being a part of Asia. We've grown up with this notion. I expect Fraser's vision will be more likely to be implemented once my generation takes the reigns of power. Of course, Asia will be quite a different place geopolitically by then. We may have made our ourselves more or less irrelevant by then...
And we could end up being left to defend ourselves. It's happened before with the British in WWII.
A nice exercise in the area where this is actually useful.
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