Al-Khalid based on T-72 ?

DPRKUnderground

DPRKUnderground

Junior Member
adeptitus said:
A few comments:

* I think the EE-T1 is a better comparison to the Al-Khalid, because the two are similiar in weight class. It'd be unfair to compare the Al-Khalid to the M1A2 due to large weight gap.

* Since Engesa was facing bankruptcy, I believe Pakistan could've came in with a strong bargaining position for part-ownership and technology transfer. Additional manufacturing facilities could be built in Pakistan, and thus dodge potential arms sanctions.

* Pakistan and PRC's joint projects, such as the Al-Khalid/MBT-2000, K-8, and FC-1, seem to result in products that the PLA & PLAAF doesn't want for themselves.

* Red not dead is correct - Egypt's locally assembled M1A1, not M1A2, my bad. I recall they requested a 120mm gun & ammo upgrade package some years ago, but am not sure if it's been completed.




I think a good question to ask is, does Pakistan need a Heavy MBT, or possibly high-low mix? Pakistan does not own any heavy MBT's in the same weight class as M1A1/M1A2, Merkava 4, or Challenger 2.

The Indo-Pakistan border is probably one of the last remaining locations with potential for large scale MBT battles. It's said that in the 1965 war, close to 1,000 tanks were deployed from both sides. How well would Pakistani's lighter MBT's perform in the future, against the much heavier Arjun Mk1?
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First of all the Arjun is having major problems. The engine is catching fire, maneuverability is horrid, and it's a little too heavy. Eastern tank philosiphy calls for a lighter tank. The Arjun is by far the heaviest, but it's based on Western stuff. The K-1A1 weighs 55 tons. That's the heaviest tanks in Asia besides the Arjun. If you look at India's tank inventory, most of it is light. T-72s and T-90s both weigh under 50 tons. Pakistan's requirements calls for a fast, light tank that can operate well in the desert and get the first kill. It's gun can fire ATGMs and I've heard that a Bakhtar Shikan round is being developed. Keep in mind it also has the Hunter-Killer system. It's wants to get that first round out before the other tank can and let the ERA take the hit for it.
 
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Nethappy

NO WAR PLS
VIP Professional
Pakistan and PRC's joint projects, such as the Al-Khalid/MBT-2000, K-8, and FC-1, seem to result in products that the PLA & PLAAF doesn't want for themselves.
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FC-1 and the Al-Khalid/MBT-2000 maybe.
But not the JL-8 /K-8 it enter service PLAAF in the late 1990s to replace the ageing JJ-5 for basic jet flight training.

The Arjun is by far the heaviest, but it's based on Western stuff. The K-1A1 weighs 55 tons.
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Weight / Max road speed / Max off road / power-to-weight ratio
The K1/A1 54.5t not 55/ 65km/h / unknown / 23.5hp/t

The Arjun 58.5t / 70 - 72 km/h depend on source of info / 40 km/h / 24 hp/t

The Type 99 54t / 80km/h / 60km/h / 27.78hp/t

The MBT2000/Al-Khalid 46t / 72km/h / 50km/h / 26hp/t

Well despite being Heavy the Arjun had better maneuverability then the K1/A1

I was supprise dat the Type 99 had the best on paper maneuverability out of all of them.

The Al-khalid had a little off road speed advantage but dat about it, I think is really improtant for the Pak to work on there gun, and extending it max fire range if possible, on then it has a chance to be a real Hunter-Killer system.

IMO the Al-khalid is better then the T-72s but can only be on par with the T-90s. The Arjun, doesn't really need to be heavy, it just need very heavy armour as the main force taking all the dmg, the T-90 can T-72 can maneuverability around to the flank to side of the Pak to attack.

IMO the Chinese Type 99 is more of a match for the Arjun and T-90, if the Chinese tank commander can get it rite and play it speed to there own good, using the 9M119 to hit the side or bak armour of enemy tank, it going to be nightmare for it enemy.
 
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ahho

Junior Member
Nethappy said:
FC-1 and the Al-Khalid/MBT-2000 maybe.
But not the JL-8 /K-8 it enter service PLAAF in the late 1990s to replace the ageing JJ-5 for basic jet flight training.


Weight / Max road speed / Max off road / power-to-weight ratio
The K1/A1 54.5t not 55/ 65km/h / unknown / 23.5hp/t

The Arjun 58.5t / 70 - 72 km/h depend on source of info / 40 km/h / 24 hp/t

The Type 99 54t / 80km/h / 60km/h / 27.78hp/t

The MBT2000/Al-Khalid 46t / 72km/h / 50km/h / 26hp/t

Well despite being Heavy the Arjun had better maneuverability then the K1/A1

I was supprise dat the Type 99 had the best on paper maneuverability out of all of them.

The Al-khalid had a little off road speed advantage but dat about it, I think is really improtant for the Pak to work on there gun, and extending it max fire range if possible, on then it has a chance to be a real Hunter-Killer system.

IMO the Al-khalid is better then the T-72s but can only be on par with the T-90s. The Arjun, doesn't really need to be heavy, it just need very heavy armour as the main force taking all the dmg, the T-90 can T-72 can maneuverability around to the flank to side of the Pak to attack.

IMO the Chinese Type 99 is more of a match for the Arjun and T-90, if the Chinese tank commander can get it rite and play it speed to there own good, using the 9M119 to hit the side or bak armour of enemy tank, it going to be nightmare for it enemy.
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well do tell me what is wrong with the AK gun, i've been hearing all about these that the AK cannon isn't power enough. I just want to know what is the problem with it

IMO I think the gun is pretty decent with gun-launched atgm and decent power
 
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Nethappy

NO WAR PLS
VIP Professional
well do tell me what is wrong with the AK gun, i've been hearing all about these that the AK cannon isn't power enough. I just want to know what is the problem with it
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I am not dat sure too, but it maybe one of the reason why the China didn't approve dat tank. I am taking a wild guess i could be a early version of the Chinese 125mm.

IMO I think the gun is pretty decent with gun-launched atgm and decent power too, but they can always improve it.
 
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ArjunMk1

Junior Member
DPRKUnderground where did u get all these B.S info ??? Engine gets fire , horrible manueaverability ..... ???

And how u are going to fire a wire guided missile(BakhtarSikhan) from a tank gun???


Actually the problem of Arjun like LCA is in its engine , the german 1400hp engine is not adequate , its large in size and wastes space for installing its huge cooling pack . Arjun will not see mass production until a home grown engine is fully developed or the Nato 1500hp engine is given under full ToT (not impossible under current Indo-Us relationship) !! Currently Arjun is in limited production series used only for training and testing .

Same is for LCA, we will have it fully inducted only when the indegeneous engine is cleared for production .Since India doesn't want to fall prey into international sanctions during war !!!!



However due to the peculair nature of Indo-Pak desert (shifting dunes and loose sand) smaller light tanks will always have its role !! Thats why Indians are also building Tank-EX by integrating Arjun's turret on T72 chassis !!!

Also the concept 'defensive tank' is nowadays being said by Indian defence personnel and newspapers. It is a tank with superior gun, hi tech electronics and heavy armour at the expense of manueverability .... May be they are using the concept of Israeli Merkava ....
 
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Nethappy

NO WAR PLS
VIP Professional
Also the concept 'defensive tank' is nowadays being said by Indian defence personnel and newspapers. It is a tank with superior gun, hi tech electronics and heavy armour at the expense of manueverability .... May be they are using the concept of Israeli Merkava ....
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Well I like the way u put dat, but no matter how heavy the armour, a decent like tank with a decent gun is going to dmg it and IMO in the Indo-Pak desert 40t size tank with good manuerverablity and gun, still going to do better.

Well compare to the Al-Khalid,Type 99, the Ajran dun have really have good off road Speed but at lease it still better then the K1A1
 
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FreeAsia2000

Junior Member
Can I just say this discussion isn't about the Arjun :eek:ff

If you want to debate the Arjun please start a seperate topic.

So far...

The AK has a problem with it's gun which is why it was rejected by China

Can anybody elaborate ?
 
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ArjunMk1

Junior Member
I really donno the details of AK gun , I read it somewhere that it has been designed in Ukraine (or Ukrainian guns are going to replace chinese guns )

Pakistanis pls make it clear
 
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