2014 Ukrainian Maidan Revolt: News, Views, Photos & Videos

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Equation

Lieutenant General
There are No SR71's unless the CIA kept them a secret at Area 51 they were all retired, and even then it's questionable as the Russians have the tech to track and shoot them.

True, but the CIA could always upgrade the SR71 to fit with today's tech, therefore bypassing Russian radar and tracking systems. Remember we were surprised about the stealth Blackhawks used during the Bin Laden raid in Pakistan were even existed. So, anything is possible.
 

Engineer

Major
It's confirmed. I tried to Find a RT counter but they seem to not be up on it yet.

Pentagon condemns 'provocative' Russian military action against U.S. Navy ship
Apr. 14, 2014 - 01:16PM |


By Andrew Tilghman
Staff writer
FILED UNDER
News
ROMANIA-UKRAINE-RUSSIA-US-FRANCE-CRISIS ZOOM
U.S. Navy personnel are pictured aboard the USS Donald Cook on April 14. Romania's president Traian Basescu hailed the deployment of U.S. and French warships in the Black Sea, a 'token of solidarity' in the wake of the Ukraine crisis. (Petrut Calinescu / Getty Images)
A Russian fighter jet on Saturday made repeated “provocative” close-range, low-altitude passes above the U.S. Navy destroyer Donald Cook while it was steaming in the Black Sea, heightening Cold War-style tensions that have continued to escalate for weeks, a defense official said.

The Russian SU-24 Fencer made a total of 12 passes above the destroyer that is equipped with the powerful Aegis missile defense system. The incident occurred in international waters about 48 hours after the Navy ship arrived in the Black Sea.

The aircraft did not respond to multiple queries from the Donald Cook’s bridge. The Navy destroyer did not respond and the incident ended after about 90 minutes. The fighter jet did not appear to be carrying missiles under its wings, official said.

“This provocative and unprecedented Russian action is inconsistent with international protocols and previous agreements on the professional interaction between our militaries,” Army Col. Steve Warren, a Pentagon spokesman, said Monday.

Warren said the incident was unprecedented. The U.S. and Russia have had no contact since the incident, he said.

“The Donald Cook was never in any danger. ... The Donald Cook is more than capable of defending itself against an SU-24,” Warrant said.

The provocative acts come about a month after Russia launched a ground invasion of Ukraine’s Crimea region and the Russian military amassed an estimated 40,000 troops along Ukraine’s eastern border. Russia maintains a large naval base in Crimea.

The Donald Cook was dispatched to the Black Sea last week in an effort to reassure NATO allies, which includes Romania, of U.S. support in the face of Russian aggression.

The ship has now pulled into port in Constanta, Romania, Warren said, near the Mihail Kogalniceanu Air Base, which is a permanent post for several thousand U.S. troops, including airmen and Marines.

Russia’s aggressive actions have prompted Air Force Gen. Philip Breedlove, Supreme Allied Commander Europe and chief of the U.S. European Command, to draw up a strategic shift in forces across his region. Breedlove is expected to make those plans public Tuesday.

If Donald Cook is more than capable of defending itself against a single SU-24, then what's so provocative about it? Furthermore, it is in international water after all, and Russian has as much right to be there as the US. Doesn't the US always talk about navigation freedom? Russians are just exercising their freedom. :rolleyes:
 
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Engineer

Major
What is that tactics? Because seizing buildings with armed thugs (RT writes where they got ammo and rifles? at nearby store?) surely varies a lot from the sit-in protests earlier. The violence on Maidan was started by Yankuovych when he tried to 'disperse' an unorganised crowd there armed with bricks and Molotov coctails by the means of force.

Can't see the 'exact the same tactics' here...

Of course they are not the same tactics. Those who are seizing buildings right now are peaceful protestors, whereas those in the Maidan violence were armed thugs.
 

SampanViking

The Capitalist
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Another day, another red line and another missed deadline.

The most interesting story today has been the confirmation by the Whitehouse that CIA Director John Brennon did indeed make a secret visit to Kiev, over the weekend, as claimed by Russia.

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On Friday, the missed crack down deadline was accompanied by an concession regarding constitutional reforms and referendums by the coup installed premier, today the same offers come from the coup installed President. He also conceded that he could not rely on state forces to obey any orders regarding enforcing a crackdown.

So far, so on script for an acceptance of Moscow's core demands for neutrality and Federal reform and that may be all that there is really is to it.

One small niggle.
This assumes that this is all "just business". I do have one question mark over this.
Right from the onset, many of us asked "how can our political lords and masters be the only ones not to predict how Putin would and has reacted so far". While it is tempting and gratifying to say "because they are stupid" we all know this is not the case.
I have from the onset, felt that this whole crisis, starting last November in Kiev, was a spoiler, something personal aimed at Putin. The more I have thought about it, the more that one thing stands out from just a couple of months earlier. It is not the Syrian move per-se, but Putins open letter to the American people in the media that followed soon after.
In this Putin not only spoke "truth to power" but also enhanced his own statesmanship credentials at the cost of the White House establishment.
In that sense I see the Maidan revolt as a plan to destroy that statesmanship image and in that sense, the plan has clearly been successful.
The danger of course is that if this is a largely personal attack, so therefore will be the nature of Putins reply!
 

Rutim

Banned Idiot
Of course they are not the same tactics. Those who are seizing buildings right now are peaceful protestors, whereas those in the Maidan violence were armed thugs.
If you can some 50k+ armed thugs in one place like it happened on Maidan I can only congratulate you. If that was a crowd of armed thugs then indeed - it's the same story. The lowest estimate of Maidan crowd was much bigger than any of crowds made by pro Russian activists now in Eastern Ukraine. Probably if you had taken them all it wouldn't be even a quarter of 20k which was on Miadan when the protests broke off. 'Seizing the buildings' and 'peaceful' doesn't go well in the same sentence as well...
 

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
Options of the West and East and possible outcomes
based on Micheal Vlahos form the Us Naval war Collage.
possibility one) the Beliruso/ Kazakstan model , this means basically Putin gets the it all. The Ukraine's policies must fall inline with Russian wants. basically reestablishment of Ukraine as a Russian Satellite state.

Possibility two) The Federated dependents. the Russian "Federal model" this is the Confederation of Ukraine. Where in power is centered at the region or province. this might be the most reasonable model for both sides as Western region would be allowed to do as it pleased in it's parts well the eastern and southern can set there own policies. Bad news is the west would likely be bankrupted.

Possibility Three) reintegrated Ukraine. This would be the most extreme thus far in that Eastern and southern parts return to Russia and the Western areas merge into Poland or Poland, Latvia Hungry and Romania.
This is not a new opinion.
Russian politician proposes new divisions of Ukraine
Mon, Mar 24 2014
By Lidia Kelly
MOSCOW, March 24 (Reuters) - A prominent Russian politician has proposed dividing Ukraine along the lines of an infamous Nazi-Soviet pact and suggested that regions in Western Ukraine hold referendums on breaking away from Kiev.
In a letter sent to the governments of Poland, Romania and Hungary, Vladimir Zhirinovsky also suggested those countries hold referendums on incorporating the regions into their territory.
Zhirinovsky, whose nationalist Liberal Democratic party largely backs President Vladimir Putin in the Russian parliament, sent the letter as Russia annexed the Crimea region of southern Ukraine last week.
He is deputy speaker at the Duma and his party holds a minority in the parliament. But his ideas and language resonate with a large part of the Russian population and the Kremlin's increasingly pro-nationalist rhetoric.
His letter, seen by Reuters, suggested Poland, Hungary and Romania, who are now in the European Union, might wish to take back regions which he said were in the past their territories.
The regions were incorporated into Ukraine when it was part of the Soviet Union at the end of World War Two and featured in a secret annex of the 1939 Molotov-Ribbentrop pact under which the Soviet and Nazi German foreign ministers carved up the area.
"It's never too late to correct historical errors," Zhirinovsky wrote.
It was not clear whether the letter was serious or a publicity stunt. But it follows a crisis in relations between Moscow and Kiev since the Moscow-backed Viktor Yanukovich was ousted as Ukraine's president last month.
Zhirinovsky proposed Ukraine's Chernivtsi, Zakarpattia, Volyn, Lviv, Ternopil, Ivano-Frankivsk and Rovensky regions, together with Poland, Romania and Hungary hold referendums on whether the regions should break away from Ukraine.
Romania might wish to have Chernivtsi, Hungary the Zakarpattia region, and Poland the rest, he said.
The proposal would allow central Ukraine to be free of "unnecessary tensions" and the referendums would "bring prosperity and tranquillity to the Ukrainian native land," the letter said.
Polish Foreign Ministry spokesman Marcin Wojciechowski dismissed the letter as a "complete oddity" and regretted some Russians "still think in terms of the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact."
Ukraine's government spokeswoman declined to comment.
Sergei Sobolev, head of Ukraine's largest parliamentary faction, the Fatherland party, called Zhirinovsky a "provocateur".
"But Zhirinovsky often is the voice of Putin," he added.
Alexandr Efremov, head of the parliamentary faction Party of Regions, Ukraine's former ruling party, said he did not support Zhirinovsky's proposal.
"Just as we have some intemperate people, Russia has some of them as well," Efremov said at a briefing. "I do not support this (Zhirinovsky's) approach." (Additional reporting by Pavel Polityuk and Natalia Zinets in Kiev, Writing by Lidia Kelly, Editing by Angus MacSwan)
This would in essence be restoration of Europe to 1792 may be expansion there in establishment of a smaller Ukraine that is made up of the Pro Russian areas that would then become part of Putin's Eurasian Union

Possibility four is the Reverse. Eastern and Southern Ukraine follow Crimea western Ukraine becomes the independent State of Ukraine. Personally I think Four, Russia gets what it wants, The heart of Ukraine's industries, the Western State is then Free to Join the EU and Or NATO as they please. Russia would Complain but given that they just got what they want.

Kerry adviser says arming Ukraine forces is an option
11:30am EDT
BERLIN (Reuters) - The United States is considering supplying arms to Ukraine, where unrest in eastern cities bears the hallmarks of a Russian destabilization drive, an adviser to Secretary of State John Kerry said on Monday.
Ukraine's president on Monday threatened military action after pro-Russian separatists occupying government buildings in the east ignored an ultimatum to leave and another group of rebels attacked a police headquarters in the troubled region.
Asked during a trip to Berlin whether the United States could arm Ukrainian forces, senior diplomat Thomas Shannon said: "Obviously we are looking at that as an option ... but at this point I can't anticipate whether or not we are going to do that."
Republican Senator John McCain has suggested providing weapons to the Ukraine government, which says the occupations that began on Sunday are part of a Russian-led plan to dismember the country.
"From our point of view what we are seeing in a series of cities mimics what we saw in Crimea both in terms of the tactics and in terms of the people involved," said Shannon, who holds the title of counselor.
"From our point of view there is a very obvious Russian hand in all of this and we consider these actions to be destabilizing and dangerous."
Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov has dismissed Western accusations that Moscow is destabilizing Ukraine, saying the situation could improve only if Kiev took into account the interests of Russian-speaking regions.
(Reporting by Sabine Siebold; Writing by Alexandra Hudson; Editing by Tom Heneghan)
 
If you can some 50k+ armed thugs in one place like it happened on Maidan I can only congratulate you. If that was a crowd of armed thugs then indeed - it's the same story. The lowest estimate of Maidan crowd was much bigger than any of crowds made by pro Russian activists now in Eastern Ukraine. Probably if you had taken them all it wouldn't be even a quarter of 20k which was on Miadan when the protests broke off. 'Seizing the buildings' and 'peaceful' doesn't go well in the same sentence as well...

Let me ask you one thing, which I don't understand about Ukrainian/Russian protests: Where are the people? I'm not talking radicals now, I'm asking about ordinary people, like here (Prague, November 1989):
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half of million of them on that plain, people like ... me, for example, hey, I really go twice a day, every freaking working day, by a tram behind those trolley poles (in the middle of that picture) ... and demonstrations like this one were going on all over the country (but smaller, of course, but still tens of percents of inhabitant came basically in every region).
I didn't see (yet??) any significant number of normal Ukrainian/Russian people on the streets now, so I might even believe in the conspiratorial post of SampanViking :) http://www.sinodefenceforum.com/mem...s-views-photos-videos-65-6796.html#post277802 Or show me a picture with at least 10% of a town's population protesting (would be about 300 thousand people in Kiev / 100 thousand in Donetsk for example), thank you.
 
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