09III/09IV (093/094) Nuclear Submarine Thread

[Jeff Head]

The experience of CdG showed why you don't do it that way.

In any case, building a reactor for a carrier is not a particularly notable achievement once one has mastered the art of building submarine reactors...

The problem is that the PRC still has problems building advanced reactors for its subs. They are not quiet enough, and they are not as powerful as they should be.

We shall see what they do with their first CATOBAR carrier...but either way, nuclear or not...it is a different game thaan the STOBAR carriers they have now.

China does not do anything without good planning and extensive time...particularly on first builds...until they have it down very right. Then they churn them out.

We shall see how long this first CATOBAR carrier takes them to build and get to sea.

 

[Iron Man]

The experience of CdG showed why you don't do it that way.

In any case, building a reactor for a carrier is not a particularly notable achievement once one has mastered the art of building submarine reactors...

Surprised you didn't mention the Enterprise experience, which shows you can easily do it that way, and is in fact the path of least resistance, i.e. least risk and least expense.

The problem is that the PRC still has problems building advanced reactors for its subs. They are not quiet enough, and they are not as powerful as they should be.

We shall see what they do with their first CATOBAR carrier...but either way, nuclear or not...it is a different game thaan the STOBAR carriers they have now.

China does not do anything without good planning and extensive time...particularly on first builds...until they have it down very right. Then they churn them out.

We shall see how fast long this first CATOBAR carrier takes them.

While they may not be quiet enough, this hardly matters for a carrier. Also, I'm not sure they are not powerful enough. Not powerful enough in relation to what? We don't know the top speed of the 091, the 093, or the 093G and so have no way of claiming with any confidence that any of these subs have not powerful enough reactors. Secondly, the first Chinese nuclear carrier may or may not be the same size as the Enterprise, so even if the PLAN decided on submarine reactors, theymay actually be sufficient to propel the first PLAN nuclear CATOBAR at 30+ knot speeds.

Given the lack of chirping from big shrimps, I doubt CV-18 will be nuclear. It would also be surprising if CV-19 were nuclear. But if the reports of functional IEP are true, these first two CATOBAR carriers could easily be conventional IEP powering EM cats.

 

[delft]

The problem is that the PRC still has problems building advanced reactors for its subs.

The problem with the submarine reactors is the noise which is of less interest in an aircraft carrier.
China recently published the development of a family of marine reactors for SCS islands, oil and gas exploration at sea and ship propulsion. That is likely to include the reactor design intended for later aircraft carriers.

 

[Jeff Head]

Surprised you didn't mention the Enterprise experience, which shows you can easily do it that way, and is in fact the path of least resistance, i.e. least risk and least expense.


While they may not be quiet enough, this hardly matters for a carrier. Also, I'm not sure they are not powerful enough. Not powerful enough in relation to what? We don't know the top speed of the 091, the 093, or the 093G and so have no way of claiming with any confidence that any of these subs have not powerful enough reactors. Secondly, the first Chinese nuclear carrier may or may not be the same size as the Enterprise, so even if the PLAN decided on submarine reactors, they may actually be sufficient to propel the first PLAN nuclear CATOBAR at 30+ knot speeds.

It is known how fast the Type 93s and their improved ones are...and it is known outside of the PRC by the US. And I will leave it there.

Given the lack of chirping from big shrimps, I doubt CV-18 will be nuclear. It would also be surprising if CV-19 were nuclear. But if the reports of functional IEP are true, these first two CATOBAR carriers could easily be conventional IEP powering EM cats.

I have always predicted that it is likely that the PLAN will build two conventional CATOBAR carriers before they go nuclear.

But time will tell.

They have shown a compunction to be conservative and get it right. The fact is, to get into very fine shape with conventionally powered CATOBAR carriers is easier and less risky for them. Heck the US did it with large super carriers for 15+ years.

But they will do what they feel they need to do..and I expect in 2018 we might see what that is.

 

[cunnilingist]

It is known how fast the Type 93s and their improved ones are...and it is known outside of the PRC by the US. And I will leave it there.

Can you comment on the 93G's noise levels?

 

[Deino]

Agreed, for this new generation of submarines a new thread should be opened: so please continue here but I beg You to understand that I'm unable to move all former posts related to the 095/095 to this thread.

https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/plan-type-095-096-nuclear-submarine-thread.t8228/

Deino

 

[Jeff Head]

Can you comment on the 93G's noise levels?

Of course you can...but please take it to the Sub thread as Deino mentioned. It is off topic here and I will move those posts to the appropriate thread.

In addition, please change your user name forthwith. such sexually explisit language is not allowed on SD either in conversation, or as a user name. I warned you in another thread regarding it a few moments ago.

 

[azesus]

It's absurd to say Office of Naval Intelligence knows the specs(speed/noise) of 093 given that the 093 probably are flanked by their diesel subs with their littoral fortress zone territory and given the lack of discipline and readiness of the 7th Fleet(Fat Leonard, Burke collision) and the recent scandal of the Pentagon can't even account for their finance keep the book straight, and yet they somehow magically know the noise level before 095 even came out, what did they ask Miss Cleo?

 

[Iron Man]

It's absurd to say Office of Naval Intelligence knows the specs(speed/noise) of 093 given that the 093 probably are flanked by their diesel subs with their littoral fortress zone territory and given the lack of discipline and readiness of the 7th Fleet(Fat Leonard, Burke collision) and the recent scandal of the Pentagon can't even account for their finance keep the book straight, and yet they somehow magically know the noise level before 095 even came out, what did they ask Miss Cleo?

You mention both 093 and 095; which one are you saying is absurd to know the acoustic levels for? I would agree that "knowing" the acoustic levels of the 095 would definitely be absurd since they don't yet exist, but the acoustic levels of probably every last 093 is going to be well-known by now. I don't think any of the points you mentioned here are sufficient reasons for the USN to not know the acoustic levels of the 093s.

 

[Hendrik_2000]

You mention both 093 and 095; which one are you saying is absurd to know the acoustic levels for? I would agree that "knowing" the acoustic levels of the 095 would definitely be absurd since they don't yet exist, but the acoustic levels of probably every last 093 is going to be well-known by now. I don't think any of the points you mentioned here are sufficient reasons for the USN to not know the acoustic levels of the 093s.

Those ONI chart is ancient !They did publish type 93 noise level even when type 93 has not been launched yet and has not revised it since. Some one from CDF complain about it So it is like azesus said those ONI chart is Vodoo make believe at best disinformation at worst. Take it with a gob of salt!