H-20 bomber (with H-X, JH-XX)

[KevinG]

I think the only reason why China still does not a strategic bomber is that China or any other country in the world does not have the technology to build a bomber which can travel back and forth between US mainland and China without air-fueling.

Why does China need strategic bomber without air-fueling but US doesn't? Because China has no safe zones for air-fueling between US mainland and China, but US has so many. So before any new ground breaking technology which will enable planes to have a range of 20,000+ km emerges, China will not build any strategic bomber.

Plus, I don't see the advantage of bomber + ICBM over ICBM itself or submarine + ICBM.

 

[Racek49]

That was a specific example which is not relevant here. That would imply the JL-1 is $1 Million, which we know is ridiculous.

I'm using the $20 Million figure to demonstrate that the cost of missiles is magnitudes cheaper than their targets.

It is usually true that missiles are cheaper than targets. But it is also true that targets usually require more missiles. So the calculations are tricky. This is where the importance of the target comes into play, and this is where strategy, politics and other aspects come into play. Well, I am not an expert...

 

[sunnymaxi]

Why does China need strategic bomber without air-fueling but US doesn't? Because China has no safe zones for air-fueling between US mainland and China, but US has so many. So before any new ground breaking technology which will enable planes to have a range of 20,000+ km emerges, China will not build any strategic bomber.

this specific thread is to discuss different theories regarding super heavy stealth Bomber.

China's next generation stealth Bomber H-20 program is near completion..

visit this thread for more information.'

H-20 bomber (with H-X, JH-XX)

For a bomber loitering time, range, and payload matter a lot more than speed. I don’t expect H-20 to be supersonic. Rumor has it that Tengyun is now completely a military project and if they need to deliver something fast, that’s the better platform.

www.sinodefenceforum.com

 

[tamsen_ikard]

this specific thread is to discuss different theories regarding super heavy stealth Bomber.

we are actually close to first flight of China's next generation stealth Bomber H-20..

I think H-20 itself will be a heavy stealth Bomber or a Supersonic Stealth Bomber. Cause if it was just a B-2 equivalent design, China would have been able to fly H-20 10 years ago.

We have already seen China flying multiple flying wing drones. We have seen a massive flying wing drone as big as the B-2. So, building a B-2 like plane is not really that big of a deal for China in my opinion.

If they delayed H-20 for so long, it has to be either they decided to make a much bigger flying wing Bomber that can strike CONUS and fit JL-1. Or they have decided to make a supersonic stealth Bomber. Both will be challenging enough to warrant the extra delay.

 

[Deino]

....

And don't forget, Yankee also let slip around the parade that the "PAK-DA" is not far from a test flight.

In that case he is totally wrong! The PAK-DA is years from first flight if it ever will happen.

 

[mack8]

You have no way of knowing that. It's rather your wishful thinking.

 

[sunnymaxi]

You have no way of knowing that. It's rather your wishful thinking.

you mean PAK-DA .. well its true. first flight is still far away.

 

[Racek49]

Well, I'm starting to get the impression that the idea of a Chinese variation of the B2 or B21 has definitely been abandoned. Their use would be significantly limited, because China does not have suitable bases located around enemy countries. And the US has enough missiles at its disposal for those bases.
Of course, an aircraft as an intercontinental missile carrier is a certain solution. However, it can hardly carry more than one missile and this also makes it ineffective, especially when it launches a missile from a distance of 8000 km. Of course, the armament of the TU 160 makes sense, but China is somewhat further from the US. The range of the H 20 would have to be enormous, at the expense of carrying capacity. And Russia has enemies all around, so the flexibility of defense must be greater.
Just such a simple layman's thought.

 

[Blitzo]

Guys, I'll be honest, but it's annoying! It's terribly annoying that in some flagship threads people constantly digress from the actual topic and talk about what-if fantasies like 36,000 t XXL-aircraft carrier or now in the H-20 thread: You are discussing a mega-XXL bomber carrying two JL-1 ALBMs for WW-3 - openly named that way - scenarios as if it is likely, realistic or already a given fact.

IMO we are already as far away from what's realistic for the H-20 like the aforementioned 360k t aircraft carrier and therefore all this fuss - IMO nonsense - is now moved into this thread as well as any political BS including openly discussing WW-3 scenarios was deleted.

Either you continue here or better leave it.

What if mega bomber options and other what-if theories!

Guys, I'll be honest, but it's annoying! It's terribly annoying that in some flagship threads people constantly digress from the actual topic and talk about what-if fantasies like 36,000 t XXL-aircraft carrier or now in the H-20 thread: You are discussing a mega-XXL bomber carrying two JL-1...

www.sinodefenceforum.com

Deino, I'm going discuss this in more detail with you in private, but at this stage the idea of H-20 being sized to carry two JL-1 sized ALBMs is actually reasonable.

The problem is that the previous consensus from 2010s to 2022-23 about H-20 being "only" a standard flying wing is no longer the case, and recent rumours from the grapevine are indicating that it seems the PLA may be prioritizing the importance of the next generation bomber carrying long/large payloads internally, which naturally will require long internal weapons bays.


Such an aircraft is not too extraordinary and nowhere near as unrealistic as the idea of a 360,000 ton aircraft carrier -- something the size of LAP, powered by four non afterburning WS-10 class engines, aimed for only high subsonic speeds (not supersonic) is actually fairly in line with reality and could conceivably have two long weapons bays for something sized for JL-1 (as opposed to two wide weapons bays on B-2).
In fact, in terms of weight, such a bomber would not be that much heavier than a B-2.

I agree that discussions around such a platform need to be careful to not venture into geopolitics and WWIII situations too much, but I strongly believe the idea of a "H-20 sized to carry two JL-1s" very much is a reasonable one within the bounds of credible debate.

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I'm going to lock this thread and also the other thread for a while until we are able to reconcile this situation because otherwise having two parallel threads can get messy.

 

[Blitzo]

Locking this thread and the H-20 thread for now.