The start of a thaw in Russia-Pakistan ties ?

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FreeAsia2000

Junior Member
I just read the following interesting news item.

Maybe Russia is considering expanding it's ties after the recent
change in US-India relations ?

KAMAZ, one of the Russia's biggest car makers, announced its intentions to launch its production capacities in Ukraine and Azerbaijan, as well as to organize its manufacture in Iran and Pakistan, according to the Company's report.

KAMAZ is in talks with strategic partners regarding the production of cabins, fuel and energy equipment. The Company declined to disclose its strategic partners.

Besides KAMAZ plans to acquire "Tuymazinsky Motormixer Plant".

"AK&M", 14/03/2006 17:24
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I also read this recent article which may explain the above

China is fully aware that the US is using its nuclear deal with India to put pressure on Beijing. China will continue its similar maneuvers by using Pakistan to put pressure on India, its growing trade ties with Delhi notwithstanding. US-Russia ties relations have recently become visibly competitive in Central Asia. So Moscow would be receptive to making its own deals with Pakistan to create undercurrents within its neighborhood that would place it in a more competitive position vis-a-vis Washington.
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It appears that a MAJOR realignment of forces is now taking place. Russia
may decide that Pakistan as an ally in Central Asia carries more conceivable benefits as well as providing a transit route for Russia goods to the middle east, africa and south east asia possibley via Gwadar ?
 
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Indianfighter

Indianfighter

Junior Member
A Russian oil company has also proposed to set up the pipeline for the Iran-Pakistan-India gas pipeline.

But the setting up of a car assembly plant or gas pipeline is not an implication that there is a strategic relation developing between Russia and Pakistan.

As an example, India and China have far more volume of trade between themselves, than between Pakistan and China. It exceeds $12 billion dollars as compared to $1 billion between Pak and China.

That doesnt mean that China shall start exporting J-10s, nuclear power plants, etc. to India.
 
F

FreeAsia2000

Junior Member
Indianfighter said:
A Russian oil company has also proposed to set up the pipeline for the Iran-Pakistan-India gas pipeline.

But the setting up of a car assembly plant or gas pipeline is not an implication that there is a strategic relation developing between Russia and Pakistan.

As an example, India and China have far more volume of trade between themselves, than between Pakistan and China. It exceeds $12 billion dollars as compared to $1 billion between Pak and China.

That doesnt mean that China shall start exporting J-10s, nuclear power plants, etc. to India.
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Agreed.

However please see the edited version of my original post.

Apologies for not posting it earler :)
 
Indianfighter

Indianfighter

Junior Member
Russia and Pakistan officially recognize each other, and are free to conduct trade between themselves. UN, India, US cannot stop them from doing so.

India did not raise any concern about Russia proposing to build the gas pipeline in Pakistan. I dont think it will raise any concern for the proposed car assembly plant either.

But it is not likely that Su-30 MK, supersonic cruise missiles, nuclear submarines, space engines, fifth generation fighter, shall be sold to Pakistan by Russia, because in these areas, India has formed a strategic partnership with Russia, and all these shall be futile if Russia collaborates on such defence deals to Pakistan.

Not sharing the technology of such arms with hostile nations is one of the pre-requisites for the defence co-operation between India and Russia.
 
F

FreeAsia2000

Junior Member
Indianfighter said:
Russia and Pakistan officially recognize each other, and are free to conduct trade between themselves. UN, India, US cannot stop them from doing so.

India did not raise any concern about Russia proposing to build the gas pipeline in Pakistan. I dont think it will raise any concern for the proposed car assembly plant either.

But it is not likely that Su-30 MK, supersonic cruise missiles, nuclear submarines, space engines, fifth generation fighter, shall be sold to Pakistan by Russia, because in these areas, India has formed a strategic partnership with Russia, and all these shall be futile if Russia collaborates on such defence deals to Pakistan.

Not sharing the technology of such arms with hostile nations is one of the pre-requisites for the defence co-operation between India and Russia.
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We shall see after all after the cold-war EVERYTHING is in a state of flux
and certainly this is a very positive sign for Pak-Rus relations...I think
the last time Russia and Pakistan even co-operated on anything like
this was in the 1950's ...nearly 60 years ago !
 
Diving Falcon

Diving Falcon

Junior Member
For the time being all major Russian-Pakistan defence relations are occuring indirectly with proxies including Ukraine, China, etc. The RD-93 and T-84 being prime examples. However the future can be different and for all we know India would be the West's ally while Pakistan is the East's. But I honestly believe that both Pakistan and India will have complex ties with both the East and West to ensure their own interests; despite apparent military build-up, no one is likely willing to go to war.
 
MIGleader

MIGleader

Banned Idiot
Indianfighter said:
Russia and Pakistan officially recognize each other, and are free to conduct trade between themselves. UN, India, US cannot stop them from doing so.

India did not raise any concern about Russia proposing to build the gas pipeline in Pakistan. I dont think it will raise any concern for the proposed car assembly plant either.

But it is not likely that Su-30 MK, supersonic cruise missiles, nuclear submarines, space engines, fifth generation fighter, shall be sold to Pakistan by Russia, because in these areas, India has formed a strategic partnership with Russia, and all these shall be futile if Russia collaborates on such defence deals to Pakistan.

Not sharing the technology of such arms with hostile nations is one of the pre-requisites for the defence co-operation between India and Russia.
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Perhaps so, but Russia will do anything for a profit. That includes selling weapons to china which will in turn be retailed to pakistan. This may already occur with the RD-93. Russia, of course, will deny any military relations with pakistan on the international stage.

All in good time. Economical and political relatiosn must warm a considerable deal before any talk over weapons begin.
 
F

FreeAsia2000

Junior Member
MIGleader said:
Perhaps so, but Russia will do anything for a profit. That includes selling weapons to china which will in turn be retailed to pakistan. This may already occur with the RD-93. Russia, of course, will deny any military relations with pakistan on the international stage.

All in good time. Economical and political relatiosn must warm a considerable deal before any talk over weapons begin.
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MIGleader EXACTLY !...the usual scenario in relations between two states
is for economic and cultural relations first and then military relations after.

The process started in the 1950's with USSR-Pakistan when USSR was
assisting Pakistan with it's dam building efforts however the military
takeover backed by US anti-communist efforts and CENTO put paid to that

Pakistan's relations with Central Asia are on the rise and therefore it
may be beneficial for BOTH countries to have good relations

Obviously both Russia and Pakistan are mature enough to realise that cold
war politics are now dead and energy supplies economics is going to be THE most significant factor in furure relations between countries
 
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Diving Falcon

Diving Falcon

Junior Member
It will take time but if Pakistan becomes an SCO member then there is a pretty good chance it will push for relations with Russia (and vice-versa); economic trade, Gwader, gas-pipelines, infrastructure, education, energy would be the top of discussions. Remember it takes a good economy to have a good military and of course Pakistan is in no financial/political situation to acquire weaponry from anyone other than China and U.S.

But I believe that any Russia-Pakistan defence ties will be done through proxies like Ukraine and China.
 
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