Soldiers surrendered without firing a shot

king

Just Hatched
Registered Member
Govt pushes for talks to get troops freed: ‘Soldiers surrendered without firing a shot’




By Alamgir Bhittani



TANK, Aug 31: With the government appearing in disarray over the seizure of more than 150 soldiers in the restive South Waziristan tribal agency, militants on Friday seized in the Frontier Region’s Jandola area four vehicles along with five drivers. The vehicles were carrying rations for security forces.

Though the exact number of missing soldiers was yet to be confirmed, security officials put the number at 156.

However, tribal sources claimed that the number of security personnel held hostage was about 205, including 105 regular troops and 100 personnel of the Frontier Corps. A colonel, three majors and some captains were among the personnel seized by militants.

A jirga comprising parliamentarians and 35 Mehsud tribal elders left Wana for Laddah on Friday for talks with militants after meeting Political Agent Hussainzada Khan in Wana. Mr Khan along with Senator Salih Shah had rushed to Wana in a military helicopter to initiate the dialogue.

Political authorities, meanwhile, detained 20 Mehsud tribesmen in Jandola under the territorial responsibility clause of the Frontier Crimes Regulations to mount pressure on militants to free the security personnel.

Witnesses said the political authorities had initially apprehended 200 tribesmen from a passenger van at Kawar checkpoint near Mianja Fort but later took only 20 of them into custody.

A tribal elder claimed that only 20 militants were able to take hostage over 200 soldiers, 129 of whom were fully armed.:roll:

“It is difficult to believe that 200 soldiers surrendered,” he said while talking to Dawn. He said the administration had detained innocent people who were in fact fleeing the area for fear of militants.

Local people said the weather conditions were normal in the region and the government claims that the soldiers were stuck in the area due to bad weather was not correct.

Security experts believe that the kidnapping of such a large number of soldiers would affect the morale of security forces operating in the tribal region.

“So many security personnel getting captured without firing a shot affects the image of our forces in the country and also sends a negative signal to the international community,” a security analyst in Peshawar remarked.

The troops, it may be mentioned, were captured when a convoy going from Wana to its base in Laddah was intercepted in the Momi Karam area.

Sources said the militants had blocked the road and ordered troops to lay down their arms and surrender communication equipment. After disarming them, the militants divided the soldiers into small groups and took them to unknown places.

Director-General Inter Services Public Relation Maj-Gen Waheed Arshad avoided saying that the troops had been kidnapped. “Soldiers are with the local tribesmen somewhere in Laddah area. It cannot be termed as kidnapping,” he told Dawn.

He claimed that there had been some misunderstanding about the movement of troops in the area and a jirga had taken initiatives to bring the soldiers back to camp.

On Thursday, he had said that the soldiers had been stranded somewhere in the area due to inclement weather.

According to late-night reports, the jirga had reached Laddah and was likely to hold meetings with the militants on Saturday morning. —Staff correspondent Zulfiqar Ali contributed to the report

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Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
This does not bode well for the state of the Pakistani Army. This inidicates that there is either a massive morale crisis or a severe lack of good leadership. The only way that I can see this happening is because of terrible orders from up the chain of command or because the troops do not support the Pakistani Army's mission in Waziristan and would rather surrender than fight.
 

crazyinsane105

Junior Member
VIP Professional
Well, the guys that were captured aren't regular troops. They're paramilitary troops. There aren't any regular troops stationed in NWFP or FATA. The paramilitary troops (which number about 80,000) are in that region backed by Pakistani helicopter gunships. Elite SSG commandos go after high value Al Qaeda targets while the paramilitary guys are there to secure roads, checkpoints, etc.

Of course surrendering without trying to fight back is pretty disturbing, but a large number of these men are from the tribal areas themselves. They don't want to fight against their own people. The only way to make sure this doesn't happen again would be to send in regular troops into the area, but the Pakistani government isn't going to be doing that anytime soon.
 

crazyinsane105

Junior Member
VIP Professional
I have just heard reports that there were initially 20 militants asking the soldiers to surrender. The commander ordered the convoy to move ahead and go around the mountain so they would be able to flank the militants and return fire safely. Unfortunately when the went ahead, there were SEVERAL HUNDRED militants, all armed to the teeth and hiding in the mountains, demanding the PA to surrender. There really wasn't much of a choice the paramilitary troopers had...
 

Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
I have just heard reports that there were initially 20 militants asking the soldiers to surrender. The commander ordered the convoy to move ahead and go around the mountain so they would be able to flank the militants and return fire safely. Unfortunately when the went ahead, there were SEVERAL HUNDRED militants, all armed to the teeth and hiding in the mountains, demanding the PA to surrender. There really wasn't much of a choice the paramilitary troopers had...

Well that changes the situation quite a bit. However it still reflects poorly on the Pakistani Army because their situational awarness was so poor that they allowed this convoy to go ahead and they allowed that many militants to gather, apparently relatively in the open (ie no buildings around) despite the fact that they are supposed to be covering their troops with attack helicopters who, if employed correctly, could have scattered the Taliban.

But as you said, these were paramilitary troops so they probably didn't have the best communication equipment.
 

crazyinsane105

Junior Member
VIP Professional
But as you said, these were paramilitary troops so they probably didn't have the best communication equipment.


Yeah, the Frontier Corps is in dire need of new equipment. They still use old trucks and pick up trucks that mount .50 caliber machine guns. :confused: Right now the US has agreed to pay Pakistan to overhaul its Frontier Corps, but that money hasn't come in yet.
 

PakTopGun

New Member
Well, I salute those soldiers, many of us here in Pakistan are quite fed up with this American sponsored (and paid for) attacks against fellow Pakistani's. The world media doesnt do justice and portrays the issue from one side only.

The fact of the matter is, there are many tribes which straddle the Durand Line seperating Pakistan and Afghanistan. Historically speaking, Pakistan was part of Afghanistan, and the two nations history are inextricably linked. Prosperity in one country dictates whats going to happen in the other.

Money doesnt solve everything, this isn't just the international community versus the Taliban, this is the International forces joining up with ethnic groups from the north versus the ethnic Pashtuns (the traditional Afghans) who have tribal links acrosss the border deep into Pakistan. They have always lived an autonomous existence and have never paid tribute to anyone, wether regional or foreign. The last of the unconquered races of the world so to speak.

The Pakistani army is made up principally of two major ethnic groups, the Panjabi but also the Pashtuns(Afghans) who are disproportionately represented in all services with other ethnic groups representing smaller percentages.

How can you send in troops to fight against their own kinsmen? doesnt matter how much money you give me, but I wont kill my own family or people from my village! I may arrest them, I may talk to them, persuade them, but Im not going to go in on the bidding of the US or a tyrant dictator no way! Pakistani people are one of the most hospitable, honourable and compasionate people in the world, but under Musharaf's rule, this inherent trait of ours is being pushed to the limit! He's turned once peaceful citizens into victims who have lost everything.

Top that off with the fact that the US has not assisted Pakistan in acquiring more modern equipment, helped it improve its training facilities and has publicly compromised Pakistan's position in the media and you have a very messy situation. Rather than support Pakistan and the many loses it has suffered (Pakistan has lost more troops and personnel than all the international community combined) the US has proven to be a very poor Ally in this international struggle against militancy.

Most Pakistani's want to see the American sponsored dictator Musharaf thrown out and our beloved army return to the barracks where they belong and should be training to defend our borders. With strong and secure borders, many of the problems would be resolved. We want a return to democracy, which in essence, allows peoples from all walks of life, including disgruntled segments of society a channel to voice their opinions and grievances, right now, under military rule, that democratic channel is now closed, leaving only violent means as the only 'outlet'.

If anything, the level of militancy has increased since the American's supported Musharaf back in 1999. Their is mass public resentment in the manner in which his military dictatorship is conducting affairs without consultation and negotiations with native Pakistani's.

I dont blame those soldier's for surrendering, I woudn't want to fight my fellow countrymen either! They did the right thing. The time is for negotiations, violence doesnt solve anything
 
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