Chinese UCAV/CCA/flying wing drones (ISR, A2A, A2G) thread

dasCKD

Junior Member
Registered Member
Does this affect stealth with the engine out like that I notice that on j20 also
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Those serrations are a measure to direct creeping waves away from the direction of the incoming radar during head-on approach. When the radar coming in from roughly head on and hits the serration they'd deflect away from the front angle. I'll have to see if I can find the diagram for it, there was a really good one I saw here on SDF.
Yeah, the designations are a mess. Did the parade announcer call out any sort of names for systems when they would pass by? I am not asking just for drones, but all the systems shown at the parade?
We can name them. I want to call the long, pointy tailless drone Yanfei because it reminds me of her hat, kind of. I'm also going to name the big laser truck Zhongli because it looks like his pillar.
 

AsuraGodFiend

Junior Member
Registered Member
The more I look at 2 these large drones on the parade the more I convince they are not mockups only thing is the is the eots on that one the shows it's either covered or not installed like the j35a eots
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
Does this affect stealth with the engine out like that I notice that on j20 also
View attachment 159879

Ideally you'd have F-22 like nozzles to enhance all aspect stealth. Or whatever is on the J-36 and J-50.

Doing it like this does erode your all aspect stealth from pretty much most angles except frontal.

The thing is to balance cost and production rate with performance. Making it with whatever nozzle design that is used by other afterburning, all aspect ULO stealth aircraft like J-36 and J-50 may add some advantages but might have been considered not worth all the additional cost and complexity of manufacturing. These unmanned fighters are going to be produced at a much cheaper cost and at a faster pace than the J-20 and J-35. This method also allows you to just use an off the shelf ready WS-10x engine without much modification.
 

Tomboy

Senior Member
Registered Member
The Nozzle petals on the lambda wing CCA seems to be much shorter than the ones present on the delta wing CCA. Perhaps the Delta uses a WS-10C2, while the lambda uses a WS-10C.
IDK, why the different engines. Perhaps different operating environment, like one naval one airforce?
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
The revelation of the level of Chinese high end and mid tier CCAs and their operational readiness signals to the military observing world (at least the intelligent, sane and less biased one) that China's gap in military combat aviation (fighters and combat drones) has thoroughly outpaced and leapfrogged the Americans. The only potential US advantage that still exist would be turbofan engines. Not even engines like combined cycle, scramjet and rotating detonation engines. China's likely ahead in those fields with the available evidence and demonstrations shown over the years.

The gap in CCAs is even greater than the gap in fighters where Chinese next generation fighter programs are several times greater (more than 2 companies engaged) and as a snapshot, approximately 5 years ahead of the now single US 6th gen program (probably also running faster too for those how understand there's the additional variable dimension).

The fighter gap is within a generation.

The CCA gap is over 1 generation.

The US is still working on the following CCAs of which they've completely disclosed since pretty much day 10 of their program lives.


1. General Atomics XQ-67A

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Tiny <20KN (assumed since comparable sized US projects all have single 9KN engines). Can barely carry a single bomb load or two AIM-120D. First flight in 2024 and at early prototyping phase.


2. General Atomics YFQ-42

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Another tiny <20KN (assumed since comparable sized US projects all have single 9KN engines) powered medium sized CCA. Payload capacity max at 2x AIM-120D. First flight was in August 2025. Literally a week ago. Early prototyping phase - first flying prototype


3. Kratos XQ-58 Valkyrie

1756883615967.png

This one's given the usual pomp and fanfare because it's a new startup small defence company. It's kinda laughable though because it's currently got no landing gears. What you see in the image is wheels from the trolley used to carry it to its rocket launching rig. It's rocket launched and recovered via parachute.

Engine is 9KN. Payload is a single internal bay pylon for a single bomb. First flight in 2019 and still working on near production prototypes to bring project to LRIP if it gains service with the USAF.


4. Boeing MQ-28 Ghost Bat

1756883948898.png

Engine is the same Williams FJ33 used by the Kratos CCA. 9KN thrust. Payload again is basically 1 or 2 weapons whether 500kg bomb or 2 AIM-120D. First flight in 2021. Working on near production prototypes to bring project to LRIP if procured by USAF.


5. Anduril YFQ-44

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Has a single vertical stabiliser angled at 90 degrees to the horizontal. Anduril engineers must've been high school dropouts. These guys think they're making a stealth drone ... with a 90 degree single vertical stabiliser. I've read Indian interneters with more technical knowledge. This one is just... lol. Nice cash grab though. Elon would give his approval here.

This attempt's got the same planform as an F-16. Not only were they incapable of designing an appropriate vertical stabiliser set up but also could not figure out a way to get rid of the horizontal stabilisers. Where other CCAs are minimising control surfaces without really taking away performance (see even the other American CCAs 1-4), Anduril gives a whopping full set of control surfaces. Do they also want to add canards and ventral fins? This thing also has a cute $100 camera designed like an afterthought. Camera could be an Aliexpress sourced discounted special.

This CCA has at least more available power with an engine of the 20KN category. First flight has yet to be announced but expected in 2025. Very early prototyping. They are apparently making the flight prototype.


The speed for all these CCAs are subsonic. Payload capacity make these things essentially extended cruise missiles. For air to air, these things top speed out at around mach 0.8 or mach 0.9. That is going to really limit how useful these CCAs are.

None are even close to service and some might be rejected by the USAF.

Meanwhile the Chinese CCA of this class (medium type, subsonic, low payload) are already in service and have been for who knows how long. Their tactics are going to be refined and the products themselves. These things are designed to be attritable. So better make them fast and affordable.

Chinese heavy, high tier CCAs are also in operational service. US equivalents aren't even at prototyping (which usually take multiple years at the very least). Both the revealed heavy CCAs are supersonic and feature no vertical or horizontal stabliser designs carried over from the J-50 and J-36 6th gen fighter projects. Payload capacity would be roughly 3 to 4 times greater than the CCAs the US are still working on.

Engines being used for the two primary heavy CCAs in PLAAF are >120KN, afterburning capable WS-10 variants.

This gap is more than 10 years and span over 1 full generation and over 1 full class of this platform type.
 
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